Dev Patel: In my world, I’m like, look, if you come work for us, you’re self-employed. You can do whatever you [00:00:05] want. You enjoy it. You work hard, you do well. Great. You save us long term. If you [00:00:10] don’t like it, you leave. There’s no targets. There’s no time, nothing. We’re not going to charge you for courses. We’re not [00:00:15] going to charge you for any kind of clawback. You leave because it’s a free world, and I want you to do well in life. [00:00:20] So if I grow you for 3 or 4 years and you’ve, you know, you develop the skills really well, when you buy your own practice, you want to go [00:00:25] do anything in life, do it absolutely fine. Because in the day, if you’re a good person, that will make [00:00:30] a huge difference in karma and that will always come back. And I’ve got left and come back after and said, shit, we had [00:00:35] a bad time with you. We should have stayed with you after, right? And that will come out of this world. But if you’re one of those owners [00:00:40] out there, small groups or owners who just want to keep this, the same mentality of [00:00:45] I own my business. I put all my blood, sweat and tears into it and I will make sure that everyone who works there works [00:00:50] for me like a, you know, like basically like an employee. You’re never going to succeed or grow the business [00:00:55] any more than what it is now.

[VOICE]: This [00:01:00] is Dental Leaders. The [00:01:05] podcast where you get to go one on one with emerging leaders in dentistry. Your [00:01:10] hosts Payman Langroudi [00:01:15] and Prav Solanki.

Prav Solanki: It’s a great pleasure to introduce [00:01:20] Dev Patel, the owner of Dental Beauty Partners or the CEO of [00:01:25] Dental Beauty Partners, to the podcast. And me and dev regularly have conversations [00:01:30] about running and growing practices. And certainly when I’ve got some advice [00:01:35] I need or, you know, there’s clients who reach out to me about [00:01:40] selling their practices, growing their practices, or growing groups. I’ve got them on speed dial, [00:01:45] and, um, he’s often a voice of reason for me when it comes [00:01:50] to just cutting through the BS when it comes to practice growth. Um, and [00:01:55] I guess the purpose of this podcast is to just go through a few ideas [00:02:00] that we’ve shared during our conversations about practice growth, and [00:02:05] it was stimulated off the back of a conversation where we that we had recently where we said, [00:02:10] wouldn’t this be great if the cause that we were having were on a podcast? [00:02:15] So that’s why we’re here today. So def I want to just sort [00:02:20] of start by, um, getting your maybe your top tips of, let’s [00:02:25] say we’ve got a dental practice owner who is considering sort [00:02:30] of mid growth level, um, doing okay, not a, not a squat setup [00:02:35] or anything like that. And they want to take their practice to the next level. Now I get calls [00:02:40] about this all the time and, and I give my standard advice which which we’ll [00:02:45] go through in a bit. But what are the key areas of the business that that you look at when [00:02:50] you’re advising people to grow their practice? Or once you’ve acquired a practice, or [00:02:55] when you’re looking at a practice with potential to acquire. What are the key? What are the key areas [00:03:00] of growth that you look at? You know.

Dev Patel: Thanks for having me on Prav.

Prav Solanki: Um.

Dev Patel: Look, [00:03:05] I think everyone’s different in terms of where they are in life. Um, I always start with that first [00:03:10] because not everyone’s ambitious, right? Not everyone wants to have 100 practices or have £1 million [00:03:15] EBITDA business. Everyone’s different. And I think it’s best to kind of think [00:03:20] around that first, because if you haven’t got the right ambition and the drive and the kind of, [00:03:25] you know, energy and time to put into growing the business, it’ll never happen. And that’s what most owners [00:03:30] you know are going through. When I look at buying a practice of a 60 year old or a 50 year [00:03:35] old who’s kind of just checked out. Now kids have passed, you know, school and university moved out of house, [00:03:40] they’re not really needing to grow their net wealth anymore in the next ten years. They’re not really [00:03:45] that interested. And that’s why it’s an opportunity for us to go in there with the energy and the time with a young [00:03:50] partner to go in there and obviously acquire a business. So number one is the time and energy. If you’ve got that, [00:03:55] then that’s the So that’s the first step. If you have that and you’ve got the time, you know, and the [00:04:00] resources to grow the business and you can do some really simple things. First, a lot of [00:04:05] hats I see have gotten stuck in this kind of, you know, especially an NHS practice. They [00:04:10] got stuck in this kind of, uh, never ending wheel of just, oh, I’ve got no debt. [00:04:15] I’ve got a contract pretty much free of charge 20 or 30 years ago.

Dev Patel: I’ve got, you know, cash coming in every [00:04:20] year of 200, 300, 400,000, you know, EBITDA, pretty good kind of cash flow for business. [00:04:25] I don’t need to do any more marketing. I don’t need to do anything to business, because actually I don’t get paid more money from the government [00:04:30] for doing more. Right? So why do I need to do anything? And it’s crazy that most [00:04:35] practices I see, the majority of practices I see do not accept new patients, [00:04:40] right? I mean, just imagine any business in any world that says, I don’t want to have a new patient in my [00:04:45] practice. I mean, like, you’re literally just shoot yourself in the foot, right? So that’s [00:04:50] very common. That’s very, very, very common. And actually they they purposely [00:04:55] said, don’t come see us. We don’t have no more capacity left on NHS because they don’t want to have [00:05:00] the potentially awkward discussion of what can we do outside the NHS. You know, [00:05:05] and it’s a good thing, a bad thing, you know, it’s great. We’ve got a solid patient base [00:05:10] for many years that you’ve been, you know, treating well and taking care of them. And that’s good to have that. But [00:05:15] opportunity to have new patients coming in both privately and through the NHS is huge. [00:05:20] And then they also complain about I’ve got no space to to do more dentistry because, you know, I’m doing [00:05:25] 600 days per chair or I’ve got no capacity left. I had more surgeries in, [00:05:30] you know, expand the building backwards upwards change.

Prav Solanki: And I’ve [00:05:35] just I’ve just got a question on that, on that NHS piece. Right. So you said that these clinics have capacity, [00:05:40] they have fulfilled their contract or whatever. Right. And then they say we’re not taking on new patients. [00:05:45] Right.

Dev Patel: Even the whole year round, not just at the end, the whole year round.

Prav Solanki: Okay. But [00:05:50] they say we’re not taking on new patients is the reason for that, that they haven’t got the physical chair [00:05:55] space time to do it, or they haven’t got the nerves to have that conversation and say, convert [00:06:00] that patient to, let’s say, a private patient, or they don’t have the headspace to even think about [00:06:05] potentially private dentistry. Like I want to wrap my head around, like if they’re [00:06:10] at capacity with their NHS, I’d be saying to them, why on earth do you want to take on another [00:06:15] NHS patient? What’s that going to do for you revenue wise, business growth wise, valuation [00:06:20] wise versus a private patient? Right. So so I’m playing [00:06:25] devil’s advocate here. I’d be saying, what the hell do you want more NHS patients for. And you’re saying [00:06:30] actually you should be opening your doors and saying take on some more NHS, NHS patients. Right. [00:06:35] And, and you’re, you’re, you’re that business owner who’s, I guess the [00:06:40] expert at buying mixed practices and growing them rapidly. [00:06:45] Right. So what’s your lens on that.

Dev Patel: Yeah. So I think with mixed [00:06:50] practices regardless of that I I mean, I keep things very, very simple in life generally. [00:06:55] If someone comes to my front door with their NHS fee paying exempt or private, [00:07:00] it’s irrelevant. The human being is the mouth. Let’s give them the best treatment plan possible that you do [00:07:05] for your mum, or your son or your daughter, or however you treat your family. And that’s the best treatment plan. Give [00:07:10] them all the options, both within the NHS and outside the NHS. But that’s it. Keep it really simple. [00:07:15] If you do that, your business will flourish, right? But you have to have the discussion [00:07:20] with the patient. You cannot just shy away from it saying let’s do a five minute appointment for you in, out, in, out [00:07:25] and just stick to the one hat pony, which is NHS dentistry all the time. You [00:07:30] have to be discussing other options. Now, I’m not saying discuss other options. If you can’t do it clinically [00:07:35] now, I’ll be surprised if no one can offer any private industry clinically, because that’d be pretty worrying. But at least the basic [00:07:40] stuff like Typekit composite or private Emax crown or veneer. Now you might have to do some more training [00:07:45] for this, or get dentists in your practice to do that work, but that’s definitely available around the whole country. Number one. [00:07:50] Number two is why you asked the question about why would you say you want to have more patients [00:07:55] in the practice? It’s because they’ve got this simple contract with 1000 patients to [00:08:00] to service every year.

Dev Patel: They’ve been doing it for 20 years. Nothing has to change. It’s basic dentistry. [00:08:05] You come in, do a filling, do a crown, do a filling, do a crown. Whatever you need from the patients. Keep them kind of stable [00:08:10] and that’s it. And there’s no headspace. There’s no there’s no ambition or desire to do anything different. Because [00:08:15] why would you if you’re going to make, you know, 30%, 25% margin of no debt [00:08:20] every year for doing no thinking and no, you know, extra investment in the business. It’s [00:08:25] basically, you know, old school way of thinking, right? But we’re seeing in the news every day. I’m sure [00:08:30] you know, you’re seeing this too, in terms of in the news cycles, about eight out of ten adults can’t get a new [00:08:35] appointment on the NHS because no one accepts patients on the NHS in the first place. Right? If [00:08:40] you just add in some more capacity in your practice from 3 or 4 surgeries to 6 or 7, by adding in [00:08:45] some more surgeries or expand the building, you now have capacity to half the number of days [00:08:50] per jear. Deliver more care to all your patients for longer amount of time.

Dev Patel: So other than a ten minute [00:08:55] point, you’ve got half an hour to an hour appointment now, right? Um, and that’s what it comes down to just basically kind of, you know, [00:09:00] just spreading that kind of contract density into more surgeries. That’s number one. Um, [00:09:05] if you haven’t got capacity to grow, then think about moving the whole thing a mile away within a mile, you know, [00:09:10] then it is absolutely happy with you moving a practice away to relocate to bigger business. That would be a minimum [00:09:15] of five year investment cycle. So you’re actually growing the business by moving it. But by doing that you now have [00:09:20] these bigger locations. You get brand new facilities, modern. And you can, you [00:09:25] know, probably get better, you know, actual location on the high street rather than, you know, typically most practice I see are [00:09:30] houses that have been converted over years and which no one really wants to have that, but it just kind of is the [00:09:35] way it is right now that E1, D1 are really simple to get that cost the high streets, you should be looking [00:09:40] at moving it to all these vacant, huge premises that have been, you know, empty by all the shops that are leaving [00:09:45] high streets. Go there your, you know, your practice with a glass shop on the High Street near [00:09:50] your area. Amazing place to be and no problem from there just as well.

Dev Patel: Um, [00:09:55] and then the third thing is just the really basic part here is just, you know, patient journey, [00:10:00] which I know, I’m sure you know, you’re passionate about as well. Just take care of your patients properly. I mean, a lot of dentists [00:10:05] I speak to go. Yeah. We take great care of patients and asked them. Okay, cool. You go take great care of [00:10:10] patients. So what’s your patient going to look like? And it’s a 15 ten minute examination in [00:10:15] in the practice ask them how the holiday was. You know the kids maybe do a couple of fillings quickly like [00:10:20] within two minutes and then go home. And I think on NHS that is not a patient journey. [00:10:25] That is you just fulfilling your contract as fast as possible because you haven’t got time, because you’re trying to densely [00:10:30] put all your ideas on one surgery, put more chairs in, spread it over more chairs, [00:10:35] get more time back with the patient. Spend more time taking photographs, talking to patient properly, going [00:10:40] through all the options privately and within the NHS. And you’re going to get your growth just by doing that. Like [00:10:45] the hourly rate on that loan will triple or ten times easily. And then [00:10:50] obviously marketing is the last thing, which is obviously great and KPIs. But um, yeah, [00:10:55] talk about afterwards when.

Prav Solanki: It comes to things like KPIs. Um, you know, this is [00:11:00] something that um, so I’ve been through a, as a practice owner, [00:11:05] I’ve been through an acquisition. Um, and then you have acquired several [00:11:10] of our clients and also kiss Dental my brother’s practice. And [00:11:15] I was amazed at how quickly the due diligence process went through [00:11:20] with you guys, compared to the due diligence process that I went through, just in terms [00:11:25] of the racking through the numbers and so on and so forth. And I remember when [00:11:30] Kailash came to me and he said, look, I’ve had an offer and they’ve told me that, you know, this [00:11:35] deal is going to be turned around in this time. And I said, it’s absolutely bollocks. Yeah. There’s no [00:11:40] way there’s absolutely no way they’re going to turn the deal around in that time. They’re just telling you what you [00:11:45] want to hear. But Well, true to your word, it did end up being a really, really [00:11:50] quick turnaround time. Um, what is it about your process when [00:11:55] looking at numbers? And at the beginning of this podcast, I said, you just cut through the BS. Like at the beginning of [00:12:00] this, you just said, look, I look at things really simple. Someone turns up with a mouth. Doesn’t matter whether private, exempt [00:12:05] or NHS, we need to deliver a service to them. Right? And when it comes to [00:12:10] sort of either a due diligence process or an acquisition, or when you’re looking through the financials [00:12:15] of a practice, um, what is what is it that you’re looking for? [00:12:20] And why is it that when you’re doing this process, it’s so [00:12:25] much quicker than anyone else?

Dev Patel: Yeah. Look, I think, um, first [00:12:30] of all, I kind of, um, lead on obviously all the new leads and dealflow that [00:12:35] comes within the business first, just because, you know, I’ve been in 15 years, Prav I mean, I did this before I was [00:12:40] even started. I was looking at practices, purchases and parallels. Right. So now when I look at PNL, I can tell you [00:12:45] eight seconds whether or not it’s profitable or it’s complete BS. And the numbers make sense or not. Um, [00:12:50] so look, the number one is, if, you know, dentistry, like other dentists, you understand [00:12:55] dentistry and the actual patient journey that, you know, the marketing, the lead flow, the workflows. [00:13:00] Um, the dentist reputation, the clinic, the quality of dentistry. That in itself [00:13:05] paints, you know, the the back canvas of a picture, you know, then all it is, [00:13:10] is just putting the dots and, you know, the actual you know, I don’t know what you’re drawing on, on the canvas [00:13:15] together. And really, if you’ve got the if you’ve got a good PNL with a good long track history, [00:13:20] I don’t like seeing things that have grown in 2 or 3 years, because it’s just a quick kind of up and down. Um, you know, [00:13:25] good track record history, um, some good kind of, you know, fundamental growth every year [00:13:30] over a ten year period, or having the same flat growth and not having any growth, which is opportunistic [00:13:35] kind of purchase is what you’re looking for, really.

Dev Patel: And then after that, just to make sure add backs and all the, you [00:13:40] know, the clinical aspects of a PNL makes sense because the rest of it anyone can look at. But [00:13:45] it’s very hard for non dentists to understand why am I adding back this orthodontic [00:13:50] brackets. Because that would recharge it back to dentists and therapist model etc. etc.. So you know you need to understand [00:13:55] the intricacies of dentistry and to be able to really understand that. And then, [00:14:00] you know, after seeing so many probably thousands and thousands of deals over the years, now you kind of know what what [00:14:05] looks right and what looks wrong in terms of the benchmarking and percentages. And, you know, you can probably quite easily [00:14:10] work that on your head. But look where in our model and this is different to everyone else [00:14:15] because we’re investing in partners with equity both both ways. We invest in people. [00:14:20] So I’m not investing in I mean, if I’m buying a underutilised practice, [00:14:25] I’m buying the physical premises and the contract. That’s it. And I’m putting my, my, my own person in there with a partner. [00:14:30] I invest in that person to run that business. If I’m buying into a kiss or to an ascent, [00:14:35] I’m buying into people that I, you know, I think could be great partners and can grow with us in the future. [00:14:40]

Dev Patel: And that’s pretty Completely different to looking at like, you know, due diligence and trying to do what [00:14:45] other groups do, which is look at every single possible, you know, you know, 150, I don’t [00:14:50] know, maybe it’s 150, 200 different kind of checklists of just tick tick tick tick tick [00:14:55] tick tick does, you know, does kind of tick all these boxes. That’s all very relevant. Like, yes, as long as you’re [00:15:00] not going to kill anyone and it’s got a good, decent, uh, you know, no red flags in there for the DH, I’m not overly [00:15:05] fussed what I want to invest in people that I’m actually working with, because that’s the one that, you know, will be the biggest [00:15:10] growth or decline in the future. Right? So yeah, it’s not as difficult [00:15:15] in our model. And it’s very similar to how private equity works. You know they invest in people and the business [00:15:20] is great. You know, it could be good because of uh, of the market [00:15:25] and tailwinds, because of the economics and stuff like that. And, and there might be a big trend right now with [00:15:30] X, Y, and Z by actually investing in the CEO and the founder and the people in the business, that’s where you’re actually investing in a [00:15:35] team. And that’s how I look at it as well.

Prav Solanki: Well, the numbers have got to stack up, right? You can’t [00:15:40] you can’t. You bet on a on a person because you like the cut of the jib or whatever, [00:15:45] right?

Dev Patel: That that that’s a given though, right? Like that’s just common sense. And it’s, uh, it’s really important [00:15:50] to, especially with acquisitions to make sure you don’t buy into a business that’s A11 [00:15:55] pony kind of show, because that’s just going to guarantee, like if it’s a two jetpacks with [00:16:00] one guy working there doing over half the turnover and he’s, you know, retirement age or [00:16:05] probably potentially not, you know, tied in for for long term equity. Why are you buying. You’re buying [00:16:10] nothing. You know you’re buying revenue. That’s going to basically go when that person leaves. And then you basically [00:16:15] pay a lot of money for that revenue that’s not there anymore afterwards. So it’s really important to don’t [00:16:20] get too emotionally bought into the whole lifestyle of, oh, he’s got a great [00:16:25] practice and a great location and he’s doing really well. He’s got a Ferrari and a nice car. I want to buy that practice. I want to back [00:16:30] him. That’s not how it’s gonna work or hurt. You have to always buy as a model [00:16:35] in a business. What am I paying for? Because you’re not paying for a stable and solid, [00:16:40] like a like a government contract or a good practice that’s got like a [00:16:45] long 20 or 30 year history about revenue being done by principle. You’re not really buying a business, [00:16:50] you’re just buying, you know, a goodwill for somebody to leave in three or 4 or 5 years time.

[TRANSITION]: Mhm. [00:16:55] Mhm.

Prav Solanki: And one of the things that really surprises me, um, when [00:17:00] I speak to clients of mine and when I have done sort of more intense coaching with clients, [00:17:05] is, um, the number of business owners, you put a PNL [00:17:10] in front of them and it might as well be written in Japanese. [00:17:15] They do not have a clue. You know, even simple things like difference [00:17:20] between gross and net. Right. And then how that net should be adjusted for a valuation. How if [00:17:25] that principle is taken, I don’t know, a salary out for himself that you [00:17:30] need to readjust in as an associate to value the business. And they’re making the [00:17:35] valuation on the back, on the back of the fact that they only need ten grand a month to live off. So that’s [00:17:40] all I’ll take out of the business. So there’s more profit in there. Um, do [00:17:45] you see similar things in practices that you’re acquiring, or even [00:17:50] with the partners that you’re sort of, should we say, um, [00:17:55] co-investing with? And how important is it for a business owner to understand these [00:18:00] key sort of financial KPIs for running their businesses? [00:18:05]

Dev Patel: I mean, it’s it’s massive. I mean, to [00:18:10] be honest with you, it’s no one’s fault. I would say the majority of business owners in the [00:18:15] UK don’t have a clue what parallels are, right? They just rely on their accountants to send them the numbers end of the year and say, this is [00:18:20] where we’re at. They’ve got no business training and that’s okay. I’m not saying [00:18:25] that’s good. It’s okay. You can get by by doing that and not having to really know your PNL. But [00:18:30] if you want to grow your business and know where you’re at, I always compare this to a [00:18:35] health check, right? Like how you’re healthy? Like getting a health check-up. Or how do you know how much [00:18:40] you weigh? You know, weighing yourself. You got no idea. That data drives everything in my life these days. And [00:18:45] why would you not drive your business based on data, the same way you would do for [00:18:50] when you try and plan, you know, a patient’s mouth and looking at information, evidence. We’re all evidence based [00:18:55] professionals. That’s what we’ve drilled into. But we have zero training on business [00:19:00] HR panels anything. And it’s it’s it’s it’s it’s an opportunity [00:19:05] because as soon as you do that you’re straight away going to add 3,040% revenue [00:19:10] or 34% cost savings or efficiencies by not doing much else. Now, [00:19:15] some people I’m not saying everyone, but some people are actually born innately with this skill without [00:19:20] having to do any training.

Dev Patel: And they might have picked it up like like for example, I picked this up [00:19:25] working my dad’s shop when I was like seven years old or six years old, back in the day in a pharmacy and just [00:19:30] sitting there having to work out how much I sell, you know, something behind the counter over the till was [00:19:35] and what the margin would be if I sold it for this much or that much. Just kind of gave me the PNL understanding of like revenue [00:19:40] and profit margins. Right? And those are the basic skillsets you might have picked up over the years from something in your life [00:19:45] without realising. Um, but not everyone’s got that in them. So, you know, if you haven’t got that in [00:19:50] it, definitely. It’s been trained on because we spend 99.9% of our time on CPD [00:19:55] and training on dentistry. Great. No skill set on sales. No skill [00:20:00] sets on leadership. No skill sets on PNL finance. Nothing. And you just think you’re running [00:20:05] a business which is half the battle. And the other half is clinical. So if you’ve done a clinical great, why [00:20:10] not put any time and effort into it? It’s like saying, I’m going to do only, you know, I’m going to work out my legs only not my arms [00:20:15] or vice versa. You’ve got to do both because a hot body, right.

Prav Solanki: Leg day, mate.

Dev Patel: Yeah. Never skip [00:20:20] leg day. Exactly. So it’s really key. And I think it’s, um. It’s a real big shame, because [00:20:25] it’s not actually any good courses out there that exist that does this kind of level of training and Dental specific [00:20:30] practice management just for dentists at a good level. A lot of them are just basic stuff [00:20:35] like this is what profit is. This is what you know. But I actually like levers of growth because no one’s actually done [00:20:40] this before. There’s very few. I don’t think there’s any group, actually. It’s really been out there on a scalable [00:20:45] model that’s actually gone there and said, I’m doubling the turnover every three years for my practices. Doesn’t exist in the [00:20:50] UK or the whole of Europe even. So there’s definitely an opportunity there for people to learn this. And, [00:20:55] you know, people can share the knowledge and and go through it. But I think it’s super, super important. [00:21:00] Um, and it’s a shame because, I mean, the good thing is now and, you [00:21:05] know, whether I like them or not is another question. But the most of the work is out there. Do give [00:21:10] free valuations, and they do go through the PNL for you and literally go, this is where you’re at now. This is where valuation [00:21:15] is where EBITDA is, is we can do to grow it. And I would recommend anybody who’s thinking about exiting [00:21:20] in the next five, ten years go speak to a broker. At least they can give you some sort of a health check [00:21:25] and analysis on your business now, and where you need to move towards to get your number to get to [00:21:30] an exit in the future. And that’s a free of charge tool that is quite forward to have that in UK [00:21:35] because not everyone’s got that, you know, other countries.

Prav Solanki: But that’s, that’s not teaching a man to fish is it. I mean, [00:21:40] if you, if you look at that side of things and say, right, do the evaluation, it’s [00:21:45] going to be the same situation at the end of the year. Your accountant presents your numbers to you. You look at it, it’s [00:21:50] tumbleweed, and you just say, well, how much tax do I have to pay? Yeah. Do [00:21:55] you see what I mean? And that’s the majority of clients I speak to. Right. Is they don’t understand their [00:22:00] PNL. They never they certainly don’t look at it on a monthly basis. And [00:22:05] those who do look at it semi-regularly, don’t use the data [00:22:10] from it to drive their next business decisions, if that makes sense. Um, [00:22:15] so yeah, you could, you could go and get a valuation from, from any of these brokers. [00:22:20] Right. And they’ll go through your PNL with you. But what are the key numbers that [00:22:25] a practice owner, you just said you could add 30, 40% to your business just by [00:22:30] regularly looking at and assessing your PNL right, whether that’s 3,040% [00:22:35] revenue, whether it’s a cost saving, whether it’s a valuation piece, right, that, you know, if you [00:22:40] if you say to yourself, right, I want to sell my business in three years time, just by regularly [00:22:45] looking at your PNL, you can increase the valuation of your business in 3 or 4 years time. Is that what you [00:22:50] believe? Yeah.

Dev Patel: Yeah, yeah. I mean, I can spend a lot of time going through the whole thing, but just the five points [00:22:55] I would say is, um, if you’re going to get monthly panels, make sure [00:23:00] that drill down into really detailed line items, because there’s no point having 1 or 4 numbers [00:23:05] for your, um, cost of sales. Right? And it’s all bulked into one number. So it just says like, you know, I [00:23:10] don’t know, say it’s like, you know, associate cost or just cost for, for team. And that could be everyone’s cost [00:23:15] associates, staff, everyone. You don’t really know what the breakdown is. So really break down every single line [00:23:20] as much detail as possible. There are companies out there like spot on that do that for you. So you know they can [00:23:25] definitely get that. If you haven’t got an accountant, they can do it for you. Um, or you can just get it on zero, you know, or loads [00:23:30] of other kind of on the their online um, finance softwares and just, you know, do a course [00:23:35] about understanding what each line means and what what happens if one, if you, if you do that to one of them, what [00:23:40] happens to the other one. Right. Everything’s got a cause and effect on most of those line items. [00:23:45] So the basics are revenue number one. Top line right. How do you track revenue [00:23:50] now most patches just as you know just go oh we look in the month how much we’ve we kind of you know take [00:23:55] in terms of cash and then we work out how much pay a dentist and we say good month a bad month.

Dev Patel: That’s what I do. I have [00:24:00] no idea whether or not that’s good or bad or what the target is for you. So set yourself a budget [00:24:05] for the year. The budget is a target that you want to set yourself for the year over the 1st of April, or for the, which [00:24:10] is great tonight and or 1st of January, depending on what your financial year is. Now, obviously [00:24:15] in the UK most people are 1st of April, so just stick to that one. If you’re working with NHS and [00:24:20] just set yourself a target of what I want to achieve this year. So last year you made a million revenue total, this [00:24:25] year 1.2 million, right? How do you increase the revenue? There’s 2 or [00:24:30] things or three things. One is by obviously putting prices up. So weirdly enough, most [00:24:35] patterns don’t pay any prices up for ten, 20, 30 years. It’s craziness. And there’s no logic [00:24:40] behind it. They just go, oh, well, you know we want to keep the same prices working for us. Inflation [00:24:45] does exist, guys. Like it’s like it’s a myth, right? It’s not like it’s a, you know, some [00:24:50] some hidden little gem that no one knows about. It’s out there. It’s on the news every single day. If you know what inflation [00:24:55] is, make sure your prices are above inflation every year without fail.

Prav Solanki: How often should you be [00:25:00] reviewing your prices?

Dev Patel: At least minimum annually. But if you want to be a bit more [00:25:05] on it, like six monthly. Um, but if you’re doing it annually for, for inflation forecasts, whatever you [00:25:10] get from the banking and forecast application for the next 12 months, then normally thereabouts, you know, [00:25:15] um, obviously we’ve had quite big inflation for the last three years. Um, you know, five, six, 7%. [00:25:20] So, you know, we’ve been put prices up quite a bit, but you have to because your cost of goods are going up. [00:25:25] If you don’t do this. I mean, I’ve, I’ve literally been to practice last week. That week. I said my crown is still [00:25:30] £400 for the last 20 years. And I said, you do realise your margins are getting squeezed every single year by a [00:25:35] few percent for the last 20 years is probably a 50% decrease now in your margins on that same [00:25:40] product, like for like. You know nothing about it. Oh, but patients are happy and they just pay for it. It’s [00:25:45] like literally saying that I’m going to give you exactly the same, you know, glass of water today and in 20 [00:25:50] years time, the same cost by making half the profit on that for no reason. Right. [00:25:55] So, you know, you’ve got to put your prices up. And that’s a very common thing with any annually. [00:26:00] Yeah. Annually.

Prav Solanki: Yeah.

Dev Patel: For private revenue obviously not. Nhs and NHS will just do what they want to do [00:26:05] and it’s fixed. The second thing is volume. So volume is the second kind of big factor which [00:26:10] is basically doing more treatments. So more volume of offsetting, you know any procedure. [00:26:15] And that can be either adding more capacity, adding more hours or just utilising hours that are empty right now. [00:26:20] Once again, no practices I go see with an empty surgery in terms of all the hours that are not being utilised [00:26:25] in the week, is that one empty surgery? And I’m just thinking like you’re not exercising correctly. Make [00:26:30] sure you have all the hours booked out and utilised for. So that way you’re actually maximising your current premises [00:26:35] that you’re paying all the fixed costs for anyway. So that’s your volume. Um, and [00:26:40] then after you got your kind of top line and I’ll break that down to weekly targets, it’s much easier [00:26:45] for the team, the managers, the whole, you know, you know, your whole team, dentists to know exactly what targets [00:26:50] each week, have a huddle in the mornings, go through what targets are in the week and how everyone’s performing. At least [00:26:55] that way you’re communicating and you’re aiming towards something and give bonuses to the team for hitting targets. [00:27:00] You know, I know this is like really fun, but they just go every month. Everyone. If we hit target for the group, everyone [00:27:05] gets £100.

Dev Patel: You know, it’s just a nice way to make sure everyone feels like they’re on the same path towards the same [00:27:10] journey to kind of aim for a target. The next thing after revenue obviously, [00:27:15] is a cost. The biggest cost to any business in dentistry is a dentist costs your associate costs. So [00:27:20] review that if you’ve got associates in your practice who are doing like a 10th of [00:27:25] the price versus someone else in the same practice and I’m 50% or the same on [00:27:30] the same percentage. Why is that possible? Actually, if you look at the maths of that, the hourly [00:27:35] rate is the one that is doing £50 an hour and someone doing £500 an hour means that you’re making a loss [00:27:40] for £150 an hour, because your costs are higher than actually what they’re bringing in. It’s a sliding scale. 40, [00:27:45] 45, 50% silence scale or whatever you think you know, you know, in that in that area. [00:27:50] So that way everyone’s incentivised to grow that hourly rate rather than it being, you know, the [00:27:55] same. And no one has any kind of targets for it. And there’s nothing wrong with doing that. All you’re doing is you’re rewarding [00:28:00] people doing well. And the ones who aren’t doing that well, you know, have to keep growing and push themselves. And [00:28:05] then just make sure that you take care of your team.

Dev Patel: A lot of dentist costs go up and up and [00:28:10] up because they’re recruiting at higher and higher, you know, rates or other ones because they’re getting higher churn. [00:28:15] So not taking care of the team properly. So regular one to ones, regular mentoring, regular sessions of training [00:28:20] and and development really helps those dentists feel like they’re getting a bit more for their, you know, value Keep [00:28:25] it busy for them. How to have open discussions with them regularly about what things are going right and what’s [00:28:30] going wrong. But yeah, so the associated costs are really key and the staff costs. So looking at like how much [00:28:35] staff do you have versus FTE staffing versus number of associates in the practice. They’ll have [00:28:40] too many staff to have little staff. How are you utilising the time when they’re not busy because there’s taking holidays [00:28:45] or whatever else? Um, do I have time in lieu? All these kind of things to maximise, you know, your actual costs that you’re [00:28:50] paying out for your teams. And you should be doing regular one to ones with all those members [00:28:55] of teams. So that way you can go through like, you know, their kind of progression for the year, their pay rises and [00:29:00] link it to actual progression. A lot of people I hear about going, oh yeah, we just got told to give another pay rise because [00:29:05] she doesn’t leave soon.

Dev Patel: I’m worried about losing my nurse. You might lose your nurse, but have you even [00:29:10] had a discussion for the first place about why they won’t leave? How are they getting progression? Like, is it the pay? [00:29:15] What’s the issue of causing them to leave in the first place? Right? Um, if you have a good culture, people don’t [00:29:20] generally want to leave. Um, obviously life will happen, people will move house and whatever else. But [00:29:25] apart from that, you should you should be able to hopefully keep your team happy and then you know all the other [00:29:30] fixed costs like your rates and I mean rent rates. Rebate is a huge one that no one does. Even everyone’s [00:29:35] got contracts can get a rebate on their rates. So anyone listen to this right now like [00:29:40] look into it and get some money back for your rates. Right. Like it’s like you can definitely do straight away and it’s easy [00:29:45] to get money back. Um, you know, other things like looking at discounts for your materials and labs [00:29:50] and making sure everyone’s kind of, you know, maximising the procurement discounts there. Now, it’s hard to do it when you’re a small [00:29:55] practice, but if you’ve got a mini group, definitely be looking at like, you know how you can streamline things there. We’re not [00:30:00] trying to say you have to use a certain lab or have to do certain materials, but even going to suppliers and having discussion [00:30:05] with them will definitely give you some more savings than you would have by not having a discussion in the first place.

Dev Patel: And [00:30:10] then, you know, there are obviously other smaller things on there, but nothing major. I mean, you always find that there’s a lot of wastage [00:30:15] sometimes on cost lines like general and other things, because the team goes on Amazon and goes crazy and [00:30:20] orders those things and no one’s looking there. So, you know, keep an eye on that now. Most practice owners who [00:30:25] own their own business don’t let people have their own card, so they only spend money on their own card themselves, not anyone to use [00:30:30] it. So it’s probably not as much of an issue. But keep an eye on all the small things because, you know, it’s [00:30:35] not easy to make EBITDA if you’re wasting 20 or 30 grand a year on irrelevant things that don’t need to be, then a practice [00:30:40] that I want to grow, the business that don’t spend it. But yeah. And then I think the other thing is just investing [00:30:45] in CapEx on technology, because technology can really drive efficiencies, increase sales, [00:30:50] increase conversions, and increase quality of care and help patients and dentists [00:30:55] feel they’re getting better service. So, um, yeah, you know, that money’s worth it [00:31:00] because CapEx does not affect your EBITDA. Remember that guys?

Prav Solanki: Okay. So me and you both know [00:31:05] what CapEx is, right? But I guarantee you there are many people listening to this saying what on earth are they talking about? [00:31:10] Right. So I just want you to just very quickly give me a summary of that is and what [00:31:15] do you mean by investing in technologies? Are we talking about EOS scanners and things [00:31:20] like that? Um, things that will improve sort of digital workflows and that sort [00:31:25] of thing. And let’s go back to CapEx first.

Dev Patel: So CapEx is capital expenditure. So if [00:31:30] I’m buying anything that’s going to last more than a year or like, you know, a few months, like like a like just keep it [00:31:35] simple composite. It’s not CapEx. Use it. You put it in the bin. It’s finished. Right. Like that. That’s [00:31:40] a consumable that’s consumed regularly. Uh, CapEx is anything like a dental [00:31:45] chair or a scanner anything. It’s like buying a car. It’s going to last a long period [00:31:50] of time that over time will depreciate in value because it will get wear and tear. So [00:31:55] anything over normally a few hundred pounds that’s an equipment or machinery [00:32:00] is technically CapEx. So even, you know, uh, opex okay. That’s CapEx. [00:32:05] Right? And these are items where when you calculate EBITDA, which is your [00:32:10] earnings before interest, tax, depreciation and amortisation, that is what they [00:32:15] use for valuations when they buy a business. So when you go to sell your business, they’ll say EBITDA times by multiple [00:32:20] is what you can evaluate. If I spend £100,000 a year on CapEx, that will not impact [00:32:25] my EBITDA anyway. That’s a balance sheet item. Okay. So it’s really important to remember [00:32:30] that people go, oh, you know, I spend 50 grand or 20 grand on this machine. It’s going to impact my evaluation. [00:32:35] And that’s how it works. If anything, you’re going to increase evaluation because someone will pay for those machinery when they [00:32:40] buy the packs. Anyway. You add it on to the purchase when you sell it. So investing in technology [00:32:45] now is not going to impact you negatively anyway, as long as you use it [00:32:50] and it’s utilised to its maximum capacity by everybody, not just sits in the corner like [00:32:55] I see some sewing machines in the corner, practices collecting dust because no one’s using them anymore, right? [00:33:00] That’s not good investment, but are you going to buy digital x rays [00:33:05] at OPG or Cbct? And I don’t know, a scanner like an Itero.

Dev Patel: You know, [00:33:10] these are things that you should very quickly generate you way more EBITDA [00:33:15] times by multiple of seven or 8 or 6 or whatever you’re going to get when you sell way [00:33:20] more value than you would do by not having it. So just as an example, if I buy an item now, [00:33:25] I do ten cases of my idea. Because of the before and after scan, I can show patients what it looks like. [00:33:30] Those ten cases will give me £40,000 of revenue. That will then give me, just say, roughly [00:33:35] £10,000 of profit or EBITDA. That £10,000 [00:33:40] of EBITDA times by seven is 70 £70,000 valuation extra. And I’m [00:33:45] paying 20 grand for the machine. Now is that a good investment for ten cases? It’s [00:33:50] a no brainer, right? So it’s just about the basics of like, you know, what you’re investing in and how it’s going [00:33:55] to give you returns or it’s going to be better for day to day workflow. Like if I’m scanning not taking impressions anymore, [00:34:00] that makes my patients patients doing it better means that I’m spending spending more time doing dentistry [00:34:05] and not wasting time doing, you know, remake impressions again, twice because someone did it correctly [00:34:10] the first time and and etc., etc.. It’s a lot more efficient for the patient and for the dentist [00:34:15] to be doing that and saving material costs. So there’s loads of benefits out there. It’s just about what [00:34:20] works for your patient base and your skill sets and what you want to be doing. But don’t be afraid to invest in your [00:34:25] business. The best investment you can do anything in life is yourself or your business. Yeah. [00:34:30]

Prav Solanki: Absolutely.

Dev Patel: A lot of people don’t do that. And that’s where I find a huge opportunity [00:34:35] because I’m saying, well, great, I’ll do it for you and then I’ll double it for years and happy days, right?

[TRANSITION]: Yeah. [00:34:40]

Prav Solanki: Yeah. And I think on the investment in yourself side of things you were alluding to [00:34:45] earlier, like, you know, a dentist will go on 25 composite courses and they’ll ten, 15 different [00:34:50] ways in which to put this white paste on someone’s tooth to make it look shiny or special. [00:34:55] Right. Um, and then they’ll go and learn how to do this soft tissue grafting or whatever. [00:35:00] Right. All these different techniques, collusion, this, that and the other and very rarely invest [00:35:05] in, let’s say, financial or, you know, the sort of stuff that I talk about a lot is [00:35:10] the sales process, right? And certainly for me, what I’ve [00:35:15] seen certain delegates who’ve been on my sales mastery course, or we’ve done some small [00:35:20] group training for certain certain, um, clinicians as well as TCL’s, is [00:35:25] just that uplift in a confidence [00:35:30] that actually being confident about talking about the [00:35:35] value of what they’re delivering is exceptional value, rather than being embarrassed about it. Um, [00:35:40] and then B just being able to articulate yourself [00:35:45] in using really, really simple language. Um, and it blows [00:35:50] my mind at how many clinicians just don’t have that and either [00:35:55] overcomplicate it, skirt around the money, suffer from this fiscal drag where [00:36:00] it says £5,000 in their head, in for four grand, comes out of their mouth. God knows why. This whole [00:36:05] whole thing. What do you see in in your group with. I’m sure you’ve got a wide range [00:36:10] of clinicians right from those who are what I would sort of call sales [00:36:15] machines are really natural and fluent in the art of sales. [00:36:20] To those who are sort of a little bit more sort of stifled in that way. So [00:36:25] what was the general view from your perspective, and what impact [00:36:30] do you think somebody’s nailing that will have on the overall profitability of [00:36:35] the practice?

Dev Patel: I mean, I, I was very fortunate. I did, um, [00:36:40] you know, a couple of these kind of sales, ethical sales kind of courses very early on, like literally my VCE [00:36:45] year. Yeah. Um, and it was and I still say this today, it’s the best course [00:36:50] I’ve ever done in my entire life. And it’s probably I would actually say it’s contributed [00:36:55] to 70% of my success in my life, because those two, that one two day course, I [00:37:00] mean, that’s how crazy it is. And I think every dentist comes out of university [00:37:05] almost exactly the same. We all taught for five years how to dentistry. We’ve got we’re all, I don’t know, left or right [00:37:10] brained whether to like, you know, very academic and very kind of like process driven. And [00:37:15] that’s how it all came out of university. We’re like exactly the same after that is whether or not you have [00:37:20] it, as you mentioned, like naturally within you to have it. Of cells. Um, and a bit of, you know, good chat with [00:37:25] patients and that kind of rapport building or, um, you need to be taught it, [00:37:30] but everyone can be taught it. And even the ones that we’ve got in our group, you know, we’ve got a few hundred dentists, [00:37:35] you know, around, you know, in mixed practices that aren’t all come out exactly the same from university. All [00:37:40] of them get trained on cells, and some of them do really well and maybe do £400 [00:37:45] an hour. Some of them do okay and do £200 an hour, but it’s still way better than average £100 an hour in the rest [00:37:50] of the country. Right. So everyone can benefit from sales training, even knowing about it and understanding, [00:37:55] you know, how to describe things, explain things, break it down.

Dev Patel: Find out what the concerns are [00:38:00] and overcome them. But whether or not I do it is another question. And that just comes down to, once again, [00:38:05] discipline. It’s like doing the same thing over and over and over correctly every single time. Now, I [00:38:10] could not emphasise how important that is. That is like the most, I mean, the most easy [00:38:15] way to grow your business straight away tomorrow. Just doing that course. Right. But at the same [00:38:20] time, you kind of need to have that that knowledge on [00:38:25] the financials as well, because I do see some great guys who can sell anything as we you know, we know a guy [00:38:30] can sell anything really great. Revenue is great, but their cost spending is also very high and they’re just not controlling [00:38:35] the costs. And therefore the profitability is very low. So you do need to control kind of at the top and [00:38:40] the bottom. And I think it’s harder normally to um it’s much harder normally to grow the top line [00:38:45] because cost actually is easy to control. So if you if you can control the costs and the top line, [00:38:50] you’re winning. And that’s what we’d find. Actually we do have some partners who are great. You know coming in [00:38:55] new partners coming in can can do really well in terms of the top line and growing the business and growing the dentist. [00:39:00] And that’s great. But I love spending money on everything else. And if I kind of conventional scanners or ten different [00:39:05] printers, ten different, um, you know, CapEx. Yeah, CapEx stuff, which [00:39:10] is one thing that’s debt in the business, right? But then they also spend loads of materials, money [00:39:15] on labs because they think, oh, if I get a £500 crown from a laboratory in Italy, that’s going [00:39:20] to get, you know, more, I’m going to get, you know, an extra five likes on Instagram.

Dev Patel: But will that [00:39:25] make any money for them differently versus a £200 crown from a very good laboratory in London? No. So it’s going to [00:39:30] be logical about your time. And it’s all about hourly rates right. Like you can do whatever you want as long as it’s [00:39:35] high. That’s the key thing. Um, if you’re spending ten hours doing a crown from a crown in Italy and you’re trying [00:39:40] to place it and you’re only charging £500 for it, probably not making much money, right? Um, so, yeah, [00:39:45] look, I think, uh, you know, that’s really, really key for sales, but I think in general, look, [00:39:50] none of us have been trained, um, on anything to run a business. My only training I [00:39:55] had on, well, finance was I taught myself. But, like, you know, most of my partners had no, no idea what PNL [00:40:00] was. And we went through them. And that’s part of our training we do with our partners. Um, but like [00:40:05] HR, for example, don’t think only about HR was watching TV saying, you know, American TV shows saying you’re fired. [00:40:10] And I thought That’s normal. You know, that’s kind of normal in the UK. Completely [00:40:15] different in real world, man. I mean, some of the stories that that, that, that, that we’ve experienced over the years [00:40:20] now, it’s like, why have we got all this stuff at university? It’s craziness.

Prav Solanki: And [00:40:25] it’s certainly with HR. Things are changing all the time, right? I mean, you [00:40:30] know, I was, you know, running my small business, the thresh, before we were [00:40:35] acquired by Virgilio. And now, um, they’ve got a whole HR department and that’s opened [00:40:40] a whole new world to me. Right. I guess I’m learning about where I probably might have gone wrong a little bit [00:40:45] when it came to HR. And yeah, probably could have could have got away with certain things [00:40:50] as a, as a small business. Um, but I think it’s important to, um, [00:40:55] to have that knowledge because we’ve got certain people who manage the whole HR in the team, [00:41:00] and it just gives you a little bit more insight into people and what not. And, um, [00:41:05] you know, what their challenges are and how to approach that Appropriately. Yeah. [00:41:10] Yeah. Um, I guess a lot of what we’ve been talking about today [00:41:15] revolves around leading people and leadership, and I think that’s probably one of the most important [00:41:20] aspects or elements of practice growth.

[TRANSITION]: Yeah.

Prav Solanki: I speak [00:41:25] to a lot of practice owners who won’t have that uncomfortable conversation with their associates [00:41:30] or their team members. I speak to a lot of practice owners who won’t even share revenue data [00:41:35] with their team because they feel this is this is the this [00:41:40] is the party line and it regularly comes out that do you think I should be sharing our [00:41:45] revenue? Because then everyone will know how much we’re making. And I’d be like, they just need to go on the [00:41:50] Dental software, mate. It’s all there. Yeah, they see they see the money coming [00:41:55] in and out of the business, right? Just stick it in, stick it on the whiteboard, set a target. [00:42:00] It’s fine. Yeah, yeah. Um, you know, and certain [00:42:05] individuals will will drive their, Over there, go to work car [00:42:10] so that their staff don’t see their car. Right. And then there’s [00:42:15] total opposites who just drive sports cars, right. Which we’ve seen it all. Um, and, [00:42:20] and I think this sort of lack of transparency or willingness to [00:42:25] share transparency in, first of all, your revenue, profitability [00:42:30] numbers with the team. I truly believe [00:42:35] that that’s a real mindset piece that holds back growth. And I don’t know if you’ve [00:42:40] seen that. Yeah. Yeah. And what your view, what your view on that is and how that impacts from [00:42:45] a from a leadership perspective as well.

Dev Patel: I think it’s um, that’s one [00:42:50] aspect of many different things that I see that there’s, there’s two different types of leaders I [00:42:55] see currently. Right. There’s this. And I’m not saying it’s always old school, but generally this old school kind [00:43:00] of leadership style of I want to look poor, trying to make sure [00:43:05] everyone feels that I’m not making them that money and just, you know, take the cash in the bank, but no one knows about [00:43:10] it and keep it all secret. Right. And it’s like, okay, you’re doing that and [00:43:15] that works for you. Fine. But that same person will be penny pinching on [00:43:20] loads of small things. And I’m seeing it from like, you know, let’s try to recharge. I [00:43:25] don’t know, the bin bags to our associates, just anything that can recharge back. They’ll do that. [00:43:30] Let’s try to, um, you know, cut costs by, you know, um, not giving pay rises and [00:43:35] just getting high churn rate because that would say my costs. How do I, you know, protect my business [00:43:40] by making sure no one grows too much. So I don’t want associates doing too well because otherwise they do too well. Then they might take my [00:43:45] patients away from me and I’ll lose my business. And they’re always being on the defensive rather than on [00:43:50] the like, you know, the sharing and the kind of like, you know, proactive approach of running a business. And [00:43:55] I think that’s holding them back massively. And actually, the other kind [00:44:00] of great example of that is, you know, one thing is sharing, you know, your data and sharing [00:44:05] your costs and sharing like how business runs with the whole team and make sure everyone’s on the same targets.

Dev Patel: Because if [00:44:10] you’re working towards the same target, you’re finding what’s more productive. They’ve got better culture and they’re more transparent, [00:44:15] right? Um, but another good example of what I, um, I find astonishing [00:44:20] is where, you know, you might have a principal who is [00:44:25] an older inspector. I’m not saying there’s an age for that, but there’s, you know, on the old end of the spectrum, [00:44:30] the mindset of I’m like, let me tie in these associates by putting in clauses in their contracts [00:44:35] that say they have to hit a certain target for udas. They leave, they’re going to pay me some recruitment fees. If [00:44:40] they leave that, I’m going to put them in chains basically. Right. And and it’s like this mindset of [00:44:45] as soon as you work for me, I own you. I literally own you. That’s basically how they think. And [00:44:50] they won’t say it out loud, but that’s how they think, right? In my world, I’m just like, look, [00:44:55] if you come work for us, you’re self-employed. You can do whatever you want. You enjoy it, you [00:45:00] work hard, you do well. Great. You save us long term. If you don’t like it, you leave. [00:45:05] There’s no targets. There’s no time, nothing. We’re not going to charge you for courses. We’re not going to charge you for any kind of callback. [00:45:10] You leave because it’s a free world. And I always do well in life. So if I if I’ve known you [00:45:15] for 3 or 4 years and you’ve, you know, you develop your skills really well when you’re in practice, you want to go do everything in life. [00:45:20] Do it.

[TRANSITION]: Well done.

Dev Patel: Absolutely fine. Because in the day, if you’re a good person, that will make a [00:45:25] huge difference in karma and that will always come back. And I’ve got plenty left. I come back after and said, shit, we had a bad [00:45:30] time with you. We should have stayed with you after, right? And that will come out into the world. But if you’re one of those owners [00:45:35] out there, small groups or owners who just want to keep this, the same mentality of I [00:45:40] own my business. I put all my blood, sweat and tears into it and I will make sure that everyone who works there works [00:45:45] for me like a, you know, like basically like an employee. You’re never going to succeed or grow the business any [00:45:50] more than what it is now. You might do well on your own and you do well on your own. You’ll never go far. [00:45:55] And what we’re saying is, you know, go, go, go quick on your own or go far together or whatever it is. Right? [00:46:00] That’s how it works. And honestly, it’s, um, it’s quite sad because I do get associates [00:46:05] who’ve come to us saying, well, can work for you. I can’t leave because I’ve got a £10,000 [00:46:10] recruitment fee to get out of this. This one practice I work for. It’s like, how does someone even threaten [00:46:15] them that you can’t legally do that anyway? Because I’m employed and spends £10,000 of equipment fees. [00:46:20] He’s like.

Prav Solanki: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dev Patel: It’s there’s this big difference in leadership styles, [00:46:25] right? And what I’m trying to get at is everyone needs to move towards the, the new generation [00:46:30] of leadership styles because we also have to change ourselves. Right. Like ten years [00:46:35] ago when I first bought my first practice, I have to worry about dentists not having wanted to work full time [00:46:40] or not wanting to do udas. And, you know, the work ethic, it was it was it was [00:46:45] bad. It wasn’t anywhere near as bad as now anyway. Now you don’t want to go to university. They want to be earning £100,000 [00:46:50] a year on two days a week, doing a couple of days and and doing bonding of veneers [00:46:55] from day one without any experience. And I’m like, your expectation levels are here and you’re [00:47:00] not even there yet. Right. So it’s, um. It’s a tough world, but I. I always say that [00:47:05] we work for everyone who works for us. So if I’ve got a dentist or a member of a team, like a nurse or hygienist, [00:47:10] we all work for them and we have to work around them what they want. Let’s work around [00:47:15] that to make them happy, right?

Prav Solanki: Yeah yeah yeah yeah. No, that all makes sense. And this [00:47:20] just brings me nicely to, um, to the conversation [00:47:25] we had probably about a month or two ago now. And, [00:47:30] um, you were talking to me about obviously recently what had happened [00:47:35] at the fresh and, um, how I’m personally stepping back [00:47:40] from coaching. I only coach two clients at the moment, 1 to 1, and I literally [00:47:45] can’t afford to do coaching anymore. Just don’t have the time. The [00:47:50] headspace, um, and I’ve got to split that time. You know, I’ve got I’ve got to choose whether [00:47:55] do I coach a client or do I spend it with my wife and kids that that is the that is the toss up [00:48:00] right now. Right. So I’ve got two clients that I’m coaching and we’ll probably not do 1 to 1 coaching again. [00:48:05] Yeah, yeah. For the foreseeable. Um, and then you said the same thing to me, which [00:48:10] was, um, you get people or dentists asking you all the time, and can you do some coaching [00:48:15] and look, you’re running 50. How many practice is now 57, 57 [00:48:20] practices. Right. Um, you’ve you’ve definitely got [00:48:25] no time for 1 to 1 coaching, right. And um, so we got, we got chatting about this and, um, [00:48:30] you know, should we put a course together. Um, which is what we’ve done. Um, [00:48:35] start scale, exit UK. Um, and the idea behind [00:48:40] that was if me and you can come together and look, I could have shared some information [00:48:45] on this podcast, but you’ve all heard that on several podcasts before about marketing, patient [00:48:50] journey, sales and all the rest of it.

Prav Solanki: Right. But I really wanted you to hear almost like a [00:48:55] fly in the wall conversation of what I normally have with dev when I’ve got a client [00:49:00] who’s got a question that I can’t answer. Or perhaps, you know, there’s an acquisition question [00:49:05] that somebody’s asking me for. I just pick up the phone and speak to dev, and he cuts through the [00:49:10] noise. And so we’ve created a almost like a 12 month program, and [00:49:15] we’ll put the link in the show notes. And if that’s of interest to any practice, [00:49:20] owners want to be practice owners and those who are getting towards the end of [00:49:25] their journey and they’re looking at exiting and how to maximise the value. And [00:49:30] I think we’ve put together something that’s pretty special that doesn’t doesn’t exist out there, [00:49:35] but it’s got to be right for you, dev. Just, just your thoughts on, on, on the program [00:49:40] that we have put together essentially covers, you know, strategic planning, [00:49:45] financial mastery, communication, leadership, marketing, [00:49:50] compliance, patient care, growth and scaling and exit [00:49:55] as well. You know, there’s tons of courses out there that The different facets of this [00:50:00] and, um, you know, I feel quite privileged that you’ve sort of said, look, let’s, let’s [00:50:05] do this. I’m really looking forward to delivering the first cohort. But your sort of view [00:50:10] on this, based on the fact that, um, you know, you get a lot of a lot of clinicians, [00:50:15] um, practice owners come to you and say, hey, I’d like some advice and [00:50:20] help, and I’m assuming you’re in a similar situation, right? You’re just not able to give the time. Yeah. [00:50:25]

Dev Patel: No, no, I think, um, I think it’s almost a bit of a disservice to the [00:50:30] industry that only our partners get that level of coaching. I mean, literally all of [00:50:35] our partners come from normal associates growing into practice. Owners have got two, three, four practices [00:50:40] of us now, and they’ve learned how to grow a business to a million, 2 million revenue within 2 or 3 years. I [00:50:45] just want to share as many people as possible, because I feel like if we can do that, we’ll not only help more people [00:50:50] within the industry get learn how to run a business better, but to grow businesses but also [00:50:55] get better value for themselves. I mean, there’s no course that exists that will give you more value than this [00:51:00] one. I personally believe because if you’re looking to become an owner or currently an owner of one or more of [00:51:05] them, one practice and you can grow your business more by learning however many tips and [00:51:10] tricks from us over the 12 month period, and with some coaching them as well. I genuinely feel you’ll get 20, 30, [00:51:15] 40% more value from that business whenever you want to exit it or every year. And that is, [00:51:20] you know, hundreds and hundreds of thousands or millions of, you know, value, right? So I [00:51:25] think it’s a no brainer. I think it’s a shame that we’re not the only country, by the way, but all countries I go to around the world [00:51:30] haven’t got this kind of course that exists.

Dev Patel: I’ve got loads of dentists in Morocco looking like kind of like, you know, this is a [00:51:35] great course. We should actually, you know, think about doing something similar for the US, obviously. And it’s just like we should [00:51:40] be training on this level of training at university, every dentist, because this is as important, you [00:51:45] know, when you’re a self-employed dentist, whether you’re an associate or an owner, you still need to know how you how penile works, how your [00:51:50] accounts work end of the year, how you grow your personal hourly rates. These are all things you should know about. But [00:51:55] no one’s being taught this. And I think if we can spread that ten, 20, 30, 40 people, 50 [00:52:00] people a year, and we do that over the next ten, 20 years or however long you do it for, you know, I think we can make a huge [00:52:05] difference on, on just kind of building a really good sense for entrepreneurship around, you know, dentistry [00:52:10] and hopefully sharing some of the pitfalls that we’ve been through and some of the blueprints that we know work. Um, [00:52:15] but yeah, I think it’s hugely important. And, you know, anyone out there is interested just, you know, message Prav. And I’m [00:52:20] sure we can get some some spaces for you.

Prav Solanki: Yeah.

Dev Patel: We’ll put we’ll.

Prav Solanki: Put the website [00:52:25] details in the show notes. And then if you guys have got any questions feel free to message me directly [00:52:30] on Instagram. I know dev’s not available on Instagram deliberately, I’m guessing, [00:52:35] um, for personal reasons, to stop him doomscrolling and all the rest of it. Um, [00:52:40] so, um, yeah, if you I think if you want to get hold of them, it’s got to be via LinkedIn. Um. [00:52:45]

Dev Patel: Oh, and that’s, uh, with a picture. That’s fine. Whatever’s easier.

Prav Solanki: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Snail [00:52:50] mail. He was talking about old school dentists earlier, weren’t you? Yeah, yeah. Um. So, um. Yeah, I’m [00:52:55] feel free to reach out and um, inquire and we’ve got, [00:53:00] we’ve got a handful of spaces left for the next cohort. So, um, if you’re interested, [00:53:05] do get in touch. It’s a 12 month program. I would be delighted to have you on board.

[VOICE]: This [00:53:10] is Dental Leaders, the podcast where [00:53:15] you get to go one on one with emerging leaders in dentistry. Your [00:53:20] hosts, Payman Langroudi and Prav [00:53:25] Solanki.

Prav Solanki: Thanks for listening, guys. If you got this far, you must have [00:53:30] listened to the whole thing. And just a huge thank you both from me and pay for actually sticking [00:53:35] through and listening to what we had to say and what our guest has had to say, because I’m assuming you got [00:53:40] some value out of it.

Prav Solanki: If you did get some value out of it, think about subscribing. And [00:53:45] if you would share this with a friend who you think might get some value out of it too. Thank you [00:53:50] so so, so much for listening. Thanks.

Prav Solanki: And don’t forget our six star rating.