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[VOICE]: This [00:00:35] is Dental Leaders. The [00:00:40] podcast where you get to go one on one with emerging [00:00:45] leaders in dentistry. Your [00:00:50] hosts Payman Langroudi and Prav Solanki.

Payman Langroudi: It [00:00:55] gives me great pleasure to welcome Deepa Patel onto the podcast. Deeper. We [00:01:00] met on Mini smile makeover. Yes. First time, wasn’t it? Yes. Was it? There [00:01:05] was a show.

Deepa Patel: No, no. We met in June, uh, last year. Msm [00:01:10] in Manchester. And that’s.

Payman Langroudi: When we saw each other again at one of.

Deepa Patel: The again in Birmingham [00:01:15] recently. Like, I was really impressed.

Payman Langroudi: I remember I was very impressed with you at Mini Smile Makeover, insomuch [00:01:20] as most of the people at Mini Smile, maker of these young dentists who try to get jobs [00:01:25] and um, you know, you slightly different to that profile. It was clear you’ve been qualified [00:01:30] a long time, and yet you were so into it. Yes. Um, and, you know, [00:01:35] making videos of it and everything.

Deepa Patel: I made it real.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And I [00:01:40] just remember you stood out to me as someone who’s really, really wants to learn. You know, you can once you’ve done a lot of courses, [00:01:45] you start to notice the different types of delegates who are there. Yeah. Someone really wants to learn. And did you put [00:01:50] any of it into practice?

Deepa Patel: Yes.

Payman Langroudi: Did you?

Deepa Patel: Yes.

Payman Langroudi: So what what what have [00:01:55] you done? Do you do much more composite work now than before? So you do it better.

Deepa Patel: So [00:02:00] I love composites in general anyway. So I think, uh, MSM was one of the best, [00:02:05] uh, cause for me to start doing the things which I couldn’t do before, [00:02:10] and it just gave me so much confidence, um, just simply by the things, [00:02:15] the way the fish was telling about the things I felt like, oh, I can do [00:02:20] this. And as you said on the course, I was just putting all my efforts to understand [00:02:25] what I will need after the course. Made some notes. And on the next day [00:02:30] I started using all the tips, tricks, what the fish gave. And I could see I [00:02:35] got better and better and better.

Payman Langroudi: That’s nice to hear.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. And I think, um, [00:02:40] I really used all the tips what he gave me even now, [00:02:45] like, I can see and all my instruments, I got it from him as well. Made a huge difference. And [00:02:50] the best thing, I loved it the way you did the whitening, uh, introduction [00:02:55] in the course. And, you know, a know, a lot of people, they think tired and they think, oh, what is [00:03:00] all about whitening? We know about it, but I think I’ve got a lot of tips from you how to introduce [00:03:05] whitening to every conversation. Yeah, every single patient. So since last [00:03:10] year.

Payman Langroudi: So now you’re doing lots of whitening.

Deepa Patel: Definitely. So my my patients are whitening and [00:03:15] composer.

Payman Langroudi: Nice.

Deepa Patel: And um, the tips you gave like you mentioned [00:03:20] and now we’re doing smile evolution forms in the practice. And believe me, every day five patients [00:03:25] about they’re not happy with their teeth. They want straight teeth and they want whiter teeth. Yeah. [00:03:30] And I done whitening on 60 years old, 70 years old, 22 years old. So [00:03:35] it’s just a mixture. And you think you’re mistaken, that you know you’re not gonna do the whitening [00:03:40] on after 50. They might not want it, but they are the ones who.

Payman Langroudi: Want even more. They want it even more. And [00:03:45] the thing is, yeah, the the patients more interested in the whitening conversation [00:03:50] than almost every other conversation that you have with them. You know, that’s that’s that’s [00:03:55] been proved right. Unless he’s in pain or he’s got a missing front tooth every other [00:04:00] conversation and we’re having thousands of conversations with our patients, every other conversation you have with your patient is less [00:04:05] important to him than the one about the colour. And so it does come down to your mindset. If you’re comfortable [00:04:10] talking about it, the patient really wants to know what’s possible and what I’ve realised. [00:04:15] Yet it needs to be within the oral hygiene instruction area from the patient perspective. [00:04:20] They feel like the colour is to do with brushing and oral hygiene. So that’s [00:04:25] the right place for the conversation to happen. And we all do some bit of oral hygiene instruction in every [00:04:30] exam. So it’s just a perfect place for it.

Deepa Patel: I think so and I learned this, you know, when I was [00:04:35] doing some of the hygiene appointments beforehand. And I learned this, that once they are [00:04:40] dentally fit, that’s the best time for you to introduce that, you know, now you’re dentally fit. [00:04:45] Do you want to go for whitening and including myself? Now I’m reaching like next to 40 [00:04:50] and I feel like, you know what? I’m putting more attention on myself, how I look. [00:04:55] You know how I talk when I go out my dressing style, I feel like I’m [00:05:00] more interested. And when I have a conversation with the patients about this, I [00:05:05] realise they are in the same boat and they love it because I get the personal touch that, you know, [00:05:10] it’s not just you. I had whitening done recently, so definitely make a huge difference. [00:05:15]

Payman Langroudi: Now the reason I really wanted you on. You’re working at Bupa? Yes. Two days. [00:05:20] Did you say a week? But the rest of the time, you’re locum ING. Yes. And [00:05:25] it’s an interesting story because you qualified in India the whole nightmare [00:05:30] practising as a as a hygienist running around. [00:05:35] And you told me you’ve practised you’ve been in over 100 practices. Yes, that’s true. And that’s so interesting [00:05:40] for me because most of us dentists or clinicians, maybe [00:05:45] we’ve been in 6 or 8 or 10 or 12 at the most practices. And I, [00:05:50] you know, I stopped practising a long time ago. So for me it was even fewer. Maybe I was an overall, I [00:05:55] was in five practices. Yes. And even in those five practices, I saw so many different ways of [00:06:00] working, not only in terms of work flow, but, crucially, [00:06:05] business management. And and really one thing I noticed, I’ve obviously been to a lot of practices. [00:06:10] One thing I’ve noticed is I walk into a practice almost immediately. You can tell [00:06:15] if this is a happy business or if this is stressed business. Now you walk [00:06:20] into a different practice every week on your locum thing. Yeah. What reflections have you got [00:06:25] about different types of situations that you fall into?

Deepa Patel: I [00:06:30] think as you say to me, like, you know, do you really enjoy locum? I do the reason, as you [00:06:35] said, uh, I love seeing different people, different staff, different [00:06:40] patients. And for me it’s a learning opportunity. I have a lot of friends. They said, oh, [00:06:45] they don’t want to do locum because they’re really comfortable. They have a comfort zone in their own job. And [00:06:50] I have seen some of the like, you know, start from the same practice, retire from, you know, in the same practice. [00:06:55] For me, it was all about going in a different practices from, you know, high Street [00:07:00] in London and going all around the London outside London. And [00:07:05] what I have seen is, as you said, happy team. You know, when you walk in you [00:07:10] feel like, wow, I would love to come again here. Yeah. And some of the places like, no, [00:07:15] this is my last day. And the only reason is it just the way [00:07:20] the whole management, the whole business run. So I have seen, you know, manager themselves. [00:07:25] They are very much stressed about the running, the practice, lack [00:07:30] of staff, you know, empty diaries and those things. And you feel like, do [00:07:35] I really want to come again here. You know. Or maybe I can just help them to see [00:07:40] that how they can get a bit more, you know, if I can give them advice which we [00:07:45] use in other practices and they’re running successfully. So for me, is, [00:07:50] uh, the key is a key is a [00:07:55] key.

Payman Langroudi: And because a lot of us, a lot of us would say, I want to know. My equipment’s, my equipment, my nurses, [00:08:00] my nurse, how we do things. And if every week I had to have a different nurse, a different [00:08:05] practice, a different drill, a different chair, I just go crazy. But you’re saying [00:08:10] you actually that actually feeds you a little bit like you give me a couple of examples of, of practices. [00:08:15]

Deepa Patel: It’s very funny because when I walk in they’re like, you know, we have this problem, we have that problem. [00:08:20] They tell me in the morning, yeah, that your diary is full of extraction today, surgical [00:08:25] extraction, this and that. And I’m like, okay. And they’re like, do you need anything? And I’m [00:08:30] like, as long as I have a dental chair, patient and nurse.

Payman Langroudi: I’m.

Deepa Patel: Done, I’m done. [00:08:35] I think it also helps because, you know, when I worked in India, we used to [00:08:40] train in different places. And you have not you don’t have everything every time. [00:08:45] And for me, that’s the that’s my challenge.

Payman Langroudi: And if you’re.

Deepa Patel: Saying [00:08:50] it’s part of the job. So as long as she gave me one bar. Doesn’t matter which bar, I’ll do the [00:08:55] crown prep for that. So, uh, it’s for me. It’s more like, you know, doing the things [00:09:00] right for the patients doing ethically and with the minimal stuff is fine. [00:09:05] I don’t need that. The whole room with a lot of equipment, they always get me so many extraction [00:09:10] forceps and, you know, all the elevators. I was like, just one. Just like which one? I said, just this. [00:09:15]

Payman Langroudi: Is in Indian. The training. You end up taking a lot of teeth out. Yeah.

Deepa Patel: Um, not necessary.

Payman Langroudi: Because [00:09:20] here it’s very few, like like people qualify with like maybe four extractions or whatever. Like, actually [00:09:25] I shouldn’t say I don’t know. I don’t know for sure. Yeah I don’t know for sure. But when I qualified yeah maybe [00:09:30] I did I don’t know 12 extractions in total. Like like not nothing very difficult. [00:09:35] One surgical maybe.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. No I think I had a mixture of doing [00:09:40] everything and I’m really grateful for all the props. They were in [00:09:45] the uni. They were amazing. I’m still in contact with them and they [00:09:50] actually inspired me. Like the prof used to be. So simple, giving us a simple tips [00:09:55] and they’re still doing the same. And they really love reading my reviews and they say [00:10:00] you are. We taught a lot of people like in over 100,000, whatever, but [00:10:05] you are the one of them who wants to enjoy the dentistry and you are doing the human to [00:10:10] human dentistry, not just the money dentistry. So that’s the one which [00:10:15] I’m like, I’m really grateful for them. And I think that’s why I’m not really demanding [00:10:20] dentist, you know, when I have seen because I worked as a nurse.

Payman Langroudi: So yeah, I’m interested in [00:10:25] that as well.

Deepa Patel: So so I think my nurses are always happy [00:10:30] because, you know.

Payman Langroudi: Because you know what they’re going through. Right.

Deepa Patel: And once I finished patient, by the time [00:10:35] they gone out, the patient is out of the chair. They’re gone, you know, out of the room as well. And I put my [00:10:40] instruments in the dirty saying. So I’m not waiting for them to do everything. I prefer [00:10:45] my, you know, my things to do. So I want the happy team. I want [00:10:50] that dentist and nurse relationship is actually reflecting [00:10:55] on your treatment. Patients really see that. They definitely pick up [00:11:00] if you see my reviews all over the past return. It’s all about. Do you? [00:11:05] The nurses and the you know, the the way we work is all reflecting on that. And that’s [00:11:10] why people just keep coming back. Coming back. They recommend other people say, you know, go [00:11:15] here just because they see we are very happy.

Payman Langroudi: People underestimate the respect [00:11:20] that you show. Your nurse reflects on you.

Deepa Patel: Definitely.

Payman Langroudi: So. So [00:11:25] when, when if you if you say just very simple things. So if you say please, can I have this to [00:11:30] your nurse that shows you as a kind of person to your patient.

Deepa Patel: Definitely. [00:11:35] And you know, like I think some of the dentists, they don’t really let the nurses do [00:11:40] a lot of things. For example, when you’re doing something, if they start talking to them about [00:11:45] their life. Believe me, they open up. Yeah, they are really happy about [00:11:50] it. It’s not like they don’t like it. So I learned this communication, some of the tips from you as well. [00:11:55] And you know, you said the waiting. You say to that, you know, you go and get your patients from [00:12:00] waiting to, to your room. And the journey is.

Payman Langroudi: Super important, I think.

Deepa Patel: Super important [00:12:05] for me. And I learned this from central London, going back to my local where I went [00:12:10] there, and I have seen the all the, you know, the dentists and surgeons, all specialists going. [00:12:15]

Payman Langroudi: To West End or whatever.

Deepa Patel: And yeah, and shaking hands and stuff. And I was like, okay, that’s [00:12:20] really good. And that that shaking hand is like, you know, giving you so much confidence. The patient thinks, [00:12:25] wow, you know, this dentist is is that one two minutes is very important. [00:12:30] And when I started, um, doing this, it does make a huge [00:12:35] difference to my.

Payman Langroudi: Give us a couple of insights, a couple of because you’ve been a nurse. You’ve been a hygienist. [00:12:40] Yes. And of course, you’ve been a dentist.

Deepa Patel: And reception and management as well as [00:12:45] well.

Payman Langroudi: Okay. So give us a couple insights about things about those other roles that [00:12:50] that most dentists don’t realise and they should and things they could do differently.

Deepa Patel: Uh, [00:12:55] so for example reception. Yeah. I never go back to my reception. I don’t ask them, [00:13:00] you know, whether you booked a patient in did you take money or anything? I never do that because I know they did it. If [00:13:05] they haven’t done it, you know there will be some reason to do that. So my focus is all about my patients [00:13:10] because I know as a reception I used to do everything what I should do and they are doing their job. [00:13:15] So again, respecting your team, what they’re doing. So if you keep doing micromanaging [00:13:20] other people, you’re wasting really a lot of time on that. It’s the same with my manager.

Payman Langroudi: What’s [00:13:25] the receptionist day like though? I mean like, do you get stressful? Go on. Yeah. Super stressful. I’ve heard [00:13:30] reception is more stressful than nursing.

Deepa Patel: I think the reception.

Payman Langroudi: Is why why stressful. [00:13:35]

Deepa Patel: For example, is the reception is the first important phase to your practice, [00:13:40] even if it’s on the phone or if it’s in a person just walking in your practice. So [00:13:45] the way you deal with the patient, patient, as you said in a few podcasts, like in a patient, [00:13:50] might be walking to you for a lot of reasons, a lot of problems in the background. And [00:13:55] when they are being rude to you, if you become rude to them, for example, that will be just in [00:14:00] the end of the conversation. Patient is not coming to your practice. But if you take it like, [00:14:05] okay, you just listen to them like, okay, you know what problems they might just, you know, [00:14:10] say, okay, I want to come back and can you book an appointment? So that’s very important part [00:14:15] if reception not answering properly on the phone again you lose your patient. So I think [00:14:20] reception is a.

Payman Langroudi: Very rude person, a patients ruder to receptionists than [00:14:25] they are to clinicians. Like that’s something not necessary. I’ve heard that for instance. No, no. [00:14:30]

Deepa Patel: This is a different story. So I have a lot of messages coming like, you know, so and so patient’s [00:14:35] difficult to handle reception. When they pop in, the first thing I do just say, [00:14:40] you know. Hello? Are you okay? Blah blah. And when you just give [00:14:45] more time for them to talk, they just start telling you everything and they become [00:14:50] just. There is definitely reason for them being rude. And when you go into the, you know, roots or [00:14:55] in the history, there is a reason.

Payman Langroudi: Something’s going on.

Deepa Patel: There is definitely like, you know, someone passed away [00:15:00] recently or they’re not happy about overall their life and they have a health issue [00:15:05] going on cancer. So and so. So when you talk to them nicely and you just [00:15:10] listen to them, they’re like, oh, you know, I feel better now. I want to come again. Okay, [00:15:15] can you do a treatment for me. And they come back again like can you now do this tooth for me. So I have [00:15:20] done so many composite bond up after being difficult patient at the reception [00:15:25] into the room. It’s a different story. And when they finish, they are the ones who write the very [00:15:30] good review. So I think never, you know, they say never judge a person like [00:15:35] it’s a book, it’s a front page. It’s different. And when you read the book it’s different. So [00:15:40] reception is definitely a very important key.

Payman Langroudi: And nursing. Do you find when you were a nurse, [00:15:45] did you find dentists were rude to you? Sometimes it’s like, you know like hierarchy thing [00:15:50] where they like like for instance, they didn’t always know you were a dentist, did they?

Deepa Patel: No. Not necessarily. [00:15:55] Uh, some of them, they didn’t know that. But, um, I always worked wherever [00:16:00] I worked, like nursing reception, anything. I just stayed best. You know what I could do that [00:16:05] time. So if I was nurse, I was. I think being nurse was for me, it [00:16:10] was much more important, actually, because I had a lot of dentists there talking to the patients [00:16:15] and, you know, they’re treating them. So I had some retiring dentists, some [00:16:20] just qualified dentists, and I could see the whole different. And that [00:16:25] learning, I think I didn’t learn much, uh, for example, in my exams [00:16:30] or back back in India, I learn from all these observations from, [00:16:35] you know, different.

Payman Langroudi: One nurse was one dentist who was a nurse told me, [00:16:40] she said, one thing that you don’t realise is dentist is when you grab [00:16:45] the suction from the nurse in a way that’s hurtful for the nurse. Yeah. And [00:16:50] it’s such an interesting thing. Like, I’d never would even imagine that I just grabbed the suction and do whatever I’m doing. [00:16:55] And she says a bit hurtful because. Because, you know, that means I’m not doing my job right or something. [00:17:00] No. So some nuances like that, anything like come to mind.

Deepa Patel: To be honest, [00:17:05] I had a lot of dentist friends who came from India same time and we were all [00:17:10] doing exams together. I have seen some of them. They couldn’t do nursing [00:17:15] at all really, number one, because they were dentist and they were not able to [00:17:20] accept that they have to do a nursing.

Payman Langroudi: Couldn’t bring themselves to do.

Deepa Patel: It. Yeah. So they felt the nursing job was not really [00:17:25] good for them. Second, they couldn’t tolerate the other dentist doing certain things and they couldn’t. [00:17:30] They didn’t like it. But for me, again, as I said, I never went to do nursing. [00:17:35] I was there to learn a lot of things from everyone. So for me, it was [00:17:40] not like, you know, £10 per hour job. It was all about me gaining the experience. [00:17:45] And I’m using that now. So now that’s what I say. Like, now I put all my instruments [00:17:50] in place. You know, even when nurses going out, I’m starting mixing my alginate. And [00:17:55] I do impressions without them. And they feel like, you know, okay, you know, it’s not always [00:18:00] we have to do the things and they can have a break as well, and they can have a bad day with [00:18:05] a lot of things, you know, outside the.

Payman Langroudi: It’s a hard job nursing. Right?

Deepa Patel: It is hard. I [00:18:10] feel bad for my nurses sometimes because I’m in dance surgery. They have to go up and down. I don’t know how many [00:18:15] times. And that’s why I make sure that I have a super busy day when I work. [00:18:20] It’s no time for me because I’m fully booked until next year. So, [00:18:25] you know, you can see, like everyone I used to do for days now cut down to two. So trying [00:18:30] to squeeze everybody in. So I feel bad for my nurses sometimes. You know they are running [00:18:35] around. And I said you said, you know what? I’ll do this denture ease. Now you go and have a coffee. And [00:18:40] that respect. And that’s the reason they love being with me. And I [00:18:45] love being with them. That, that that teamwork. If I’m not feeling well, they will do something [00:18:50] for me, like, you know, do you want hot chocolate? It’s just a small gesture that is actually [00:18:55] making my. I love working in wherever. I’m working anywhere. [00:19:00] I just love what I do because it’s just constant joy I [00:19:05] find in dentistry, because I think of all the different roles I have done, even [00:19:10] my manager. We sit down when we don’t have patients like, shall we do this for [00:19:15] this practice? Shall we do this for that practice? Or I have seen this review thing in [00:19:20] other practice, like in our practice we do this way. Shall we try this here? So she said, [00:19:25] you know, we I need you all the time because you know, you you’re not just saying that, [00:19:30] you know, how about my patients? How about my pay? I’m all the time about [00:19:35] how we can do as a, you know, how, how good we can do as a practice. And that’s why probably, [00:19:40] you know, even now coming, helping me so much, wherever I go, wherever [00:19:45] I step in, I’m like, you know, this thing we could do a little bit better, not like straight away, but [00:19:50] just observing the whole day and say, shall we do this? And they’re like, oh yes.

Payman Langroudi: But examples. [00:19:55]

Deepa Patel: Same like a review one for example. It hurts when. [00:20:00]

Payman Langroudi: You ask for reviews.

Deepa Patel: Uh, so I didn’t ask for one year until [00:20:05] one year ago I was not. But then we have this NPS system, you know, we like [00:20:10] we send the text to them, they send the message like they just give us a feedback [00:20:15] on that. But this is all internal. So I read so many good about, you [00:20:20] know, us and sometimes this specify the name of the dentist and and [00:20:25] nurses. So I was like, oh this is very good. But that is not going to the public. [00:20:30] This is just for us. We only read how about the about other people? And nowadays, [00:20:35] you know, wherever you go, they’re all about reviews. Like, anywhere you going? For example, [00:20:40] restaurant tonight you will check, you know, 4.9, 4.8. So same thing then like [00:20:45] every patient sitting in a like in the chair and then they’re going out, they’re like [00:20:50] oh I had the I this is my best dentist ever. Or you know, I loved it. I was nervous. [00:20:55] But everything what they say, I was like, this is what you could put it down into your review. [00:21:00] And then we give them a scanning code and we have a like a dentist [00:21:05] name nurse name. I prefer my nurses name as well there because they are equally [00:21:10] important for me. We give it to them and they do it for us. And if you read them, [00:21:15] you feel like it’s all personal. Smile stories behind each review. They’re [00:21:20] not like a fake review. So we do ask them when they say [00:21:25] a lot of things about what we have done for them. I say, you know, and I say to them, you can write positive [00:21:30] or negative, doesn’t matter if you think we need to improve something, that’s the problem. Probably [00:21:35] the again, important for us. So that’s how we ended up with the good. Um.

Payman Langroudi: Like, [00:21:40] it’s obvious to me that you love people.

Deepa Patel: Yes.

Payman Langroudi: Have you always.

Deepa Patel: Yes. [00:21:45]

Payman Langroudi: Like, is it something that, like, someone, you know, like, a lot of times when [00:21:50] you’re really good at something, it comes so naturally that you don’t even realise you’re good at [00:21:55] it? No. Um. But then some people aren’t really good at it. Yeah. So. [00:22:00] So, you know, if someone wants to learn to be good at it. Yeah. Are you in [00:22:05] a position to give any advice there?

Deepa Patel: Um.

Payman Langroudi: So for me, for me, it [00:22:10] comes down to respect. Yeah. It’s respecting other humans.

Deepa Patel: Definitely. [00:22:15]

Payman Langroudi: It’s the easiest way of saying it for me, but. And also the [00:22:20] the lack of hierarchy. You know, a lot of a lot of dentists. I’ve watched a lot of dentists [00:22:25] in, in consultations surprised me how how much like doctor [00:22:30] they are. How? How? How much? The hierarchy they have. And I realised. Oh, I’m obviously [00:22:35] very casual dentist, you know.

Deepa Patel: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: So what hints can you [00:22:40] give on on that. Because obviously you find it very easy to, to love people. Um, but [00:22:45] not everyone does.

Deepa Patel: No, no. And I think that’s sometimes uh, I would say [00:22:50] there are two ways to look at the dentistry is for me, dentistry is one [00:22:55] thing, and another thing is my personal development. You know, how how good person [00:23:00] I am, that is, that is reflecting into my dentistry. So, [00:23:05] for example, if I’m not a good, um, person, then that [00:23:10] will show to my patient that I’m not really into, you know, treating [00:23:15] them as a human. And that is not working. Well, even if I do [00:23:20] really good dentistry, but they won’t really like me. So the way [00:23:25] it helped me so much in last three years is all about, um, I do a lot of volunteer. [00:23:30] I work with the institute where they want to contribute in others life, [00:23:35] and they do all free. So there are a lot of courses they run, for [00:23:40] example, personality awareness workshops. Uh, how do you like, you know, [00:23:45] uh, go like, you know, how you become a good person and those things. So [00:23:50] I think those free workshops, I would say, are [00:23:55] much more precious to me than actually the because I do paid lot of work, [00:24:00] you know, the training as well. Like you pay a lot of money in dentistry when you do one course. But [00:24:05] I think if I didn’t have that personal development touch, I wouldn’t be a good dentist.

Payman Langroudi: Explain some [00:24:10] of that.

Deepa Patel: So, for example, personality awareness workshops is all about, um, knowing [00:24:15] the person. So each person has two main personalities. There are [00:24:20] four personalities there. So for example perfect. Powerful. Popular. Peaceful. [00:24:25] So each person each personality, they have a strength and weakness. [00:24:30] So. And when you do workshops, you you will come [00:24:35] to know like for example, what your personality, what someone else’s personality when you spend a few minutes [00:24:40] or few hours with them. So and then you know, whether you know, this person is [00:24:45] going through the difficult time or they’re not really enjoying their life, or they are actually [00:24:50] very good with the successful things.

Payman Langroudi: So how do you know? Do you ask certain questions?

Deepa Patel: No. [00:24:55] So there is a way to do it. So each each personality for example popular is [00:25:00] fun way for them. Everything is fun. They are never serious about the thing. So if I’m expecting [00:25:05] for example, popular person behaving very well, perfect and you [00:25:10] know they won’t do it. So I don’t have that expectation. So my with all [00:25:15] these personal development courses, my expectations are coming down and [00:25:20] my acceptance of that person is just is so good. [00:25:25] So I don’t I don’t expect that patient to behave the way I wanted [00:25:30] or the way I am. I’m perfect. I’m powerful. So powerful. For example, they [00:25:35] always, um, want my way. Powerful. Always. Like I’m telling you. [00:25:40] Like, you know, you said some of the dentists, they want their nurses to work certain ways.

Payman Langroudi: Kind of dominant. [00:25:45]

Deepa Patel: Yes. So very powerful. They will make sure that you do work the way they [00:25:50] want it. So that again, I was powerful. But then now I’m, you know, going into [00:25:55] cutting down my weakness and going to my strength more and that helping me so much that [00:26:00] okay, you know, I’m powerful, but I don’t want to let that thing to affect my [00:26:05] people around me. So.

Payman Langroudi: So, so okay. So patient walks in. You’ve never met [00:26:10] them before? No, you’ve you’ve gone out and got them from the from the reception. Those what [00:26:15] we said those little conversations on the way. You’re, you’re sort of uh, metre [00:26:20] is you’re analysing what kind of person is this. Yes. So, so you’re [00:26:25] literally saying as he’s walking in, if he’s smiling and joking and laughing. Yes. You’re [00:26:30] going down like he’s he’s a popular, like, fun kind of character. Yeah. And so you’re already [00:26:35] forming that impression. So the powerful characters were a bit more serious.

Deepa Patel: So you know the one [00:26:40] you say the patience or dentist or staff, when they are powerful, they always [00:26:45] demanding. Okay, so now I know this person, like the powerful patient, [00:26:50] for example, is demanding. So if you just do a good communication. [00:26:55]

Payman Langroudi: Let them demand a bit.

Deepa Patel: Yes, yes. And then you discuss, [00:27:00] you tell them all the treatment plan detailing and you tell them [00:27:05] that this is a realistic achievement I could do for you.

Payman Langroudi: And they appreciate that.

Deepa Patel: They [00:27:10] will definitely appreciate.

Payman Langroudi: So we’ve got popular powerful. What were the other two?

Deepa Patel: Peaceful.

Payman Langroudi: Peaceful.

Deepa Patel: Go for [00:27:15] peaceful.

Payman Langroudi: As you would expect it to be. So very quiet.

Deepa Patel: Peaceful [00:27:20] is like easy. They don’t care about the vineyard looking, for example, to [00:27:25] precise as long as long as they have a tooth in their mouth, they’re happy. [00:27:30] They’re happy so peacefully. They’re always like, easy way. You know, they don’t want major. [00:27:35] They don’t have much of demanding patients. Yeah. And I love it because, you know, [00:27:40] then I know you know how to deal with them. Because again, uh, we do this.

Payman Langroudi: We don’t want too much [00:27:45] detail even. No, no, no.

Deepa Patel: So we do this, uh, so, so each personality, [00:27:50] they have their emotional need. So if you fulfil that emotional [00:27:55] need again, you’re winner.

Payman Langroudi: Because what was the fourth one.

Deepa Patel: So the fourth one is [00:28:00] I think perfect.

Payman Langroudi: Perfect. Yeah. They like perfection.

Deepa Patel: So for me for example I do [00:28:05] composer I have seen that composite patients so happy. But for me that [00:28:10] small thing, that little rounding uh, you know, the front central incisor. [00:28:15] So before I used to do too much into perfection. And they do plan a lot as [00:28:20] well. So now I’d say to myself, you know, As long as it’s looking good, [00:28:25] everything is good. Just. Just let it go. It’s not like.

Payman Langroudi: By the way. By the way. Learning [00:28:30] point. Learning point. When I was a young dentist, I used to do things like I’d [00:28:35] fit that veneer or composite, whatever it was. Yeah. And I thought it made me look good to [00:28:40] say I’m not 100% happy with it because I’m such a perfectionist. Yeah. [00:28:45] I thought that made me look good. But from the patient perspective, the last [00:28:50] thing you want is for your dentist to say I’m not 100% happy. Yeah. You start thinking, well, there’s something wrong with it here. [00:28:55] No, but I used to think that was a way of looking like an expert. Yeah. But. [00:29:00] But that’s not what the patient wants to hear. No, no.

Deepa Patel: I think if you would have [00:29:05] a word it right, if you would have put it in a right way, like, you know, how do you feel [00:29:10] about it? Let patient decide. You don’t decide. Does it [00:29:15] make sense to you? Of course. And. And then you give your thoughts about it, like, you know, [00:29:20] okay. You know, certain things. So for me, these four categories. Everywhere [00:29:25] I go, everywhere I work. Nurses, dentists and staff. I [00:29:30] think in the last three years, personally, I could see where I was before and [00:29:35] now it’s a huge difference. And I say to my mentor because [00:29:40] I got mentors.

Payman Langroudi: In the development area.

Deepa Patel: Area like they train everybody, [00:29:45] but I just try to take everything from them. And I say to them, you don’t [00:29:50] know that. You know you don’t have a clue in it. They are in India and I’m here [00:29:55] that what I’m achieving because of these courses. It’s [00:30:00] just making my life so easy. So for example, again, being perfectionist, [00:30:05] I used to run late because, you know, I’m not letting go. The things now I’m like, you know, [00:30:10] I’m trying to say, okay, fine, it’s all done. And then, you know, showing to the patient [00:30:15] because nurses, if she is powerful or if she is about the timing. So [00:30:20] like nurses I work with, they are perfect and I’m taking the time and like they are like [00:30:25] being impatient. So for me again, I can see why she is being impatience. And [00:30:30] I’m just trying to, you know, get into work.

Payman Langroudi: It’s interesting because if you didn’t have this [00:30:35] classification, that could cause a lot of friction. Oh, it would be like.

Deepa Patel: So many arguments.

Payman Langroudi: Ununderstandable [00:30:40] friction.

Deepa Patel: It will go in the ER. When patient walks in, they will see the dentist and [00:30:45] nurse is not in a good, you know, terms. And now my nurse and me and I have [00:30:50] usually sameness but then you know different nurses working with me. Everybody I just [00:30:55] the whole environment is so happy. We have a music in the background. We talk about [00:31:00] a lot of things. So as you say to you, what.

Payman Langroudi: Music, what music do you. I think that’s a really interesting question. [00:31:05] Yeah, I really think that’s interesting question. My nurse, when I was a dentist, we’re talking years ago, [00:31:10] my nurse wanted the local radio station, you know, the local Capital Radio, whatever [00:31:15] pop music station. And I was saying, it doesn’t matter what you want. Yeah, [00:31:20] we need the correct music. Yeah, and I’m not a massive classical music fan. [00:31:25] Yeah, I kind of kind of like it, but. But I thought classical music was expensive [00:31:30] music. Yeah. And so I wanted to do my composite bonding. I wanted to [00:31:35] feel like I’m some sort of artist. So I’m using the brush on the tooth like this. And. [00:31:40] But with classical music playing in the background, I thought I would tell her, look, I [00:31:45] really think if you have classical on or if you have pop on, you can charge 30 or £40 more per tooth because [00:31:50] it’s classical. Yeah. And she would say, no, no, no, no, we want pop music. And after a while I overruled. [00:31:55] And I said, look, just try it for a week. And then she started getting into it. So tell me, do you have the music [00:32:00] on that you like, or do you have the music on that wants to fit the mood or what do you have?

Deepa Patel: So [00:32:05] for example, I love Hindi instrumental instrumental music. [00:32:10] Uh, it’s just because I know the lyrics. So I actually sing or hum. So [00:32:15] uh, and my nurse. She is also Asian background. [00:32:20] So you know she loves and she knows a lot of songs as well. So it’s just both of us.

Payman Langroudi: And this English patient [00:32:25] walks in. What happens?

Deepa Patel: They do they do love it really. They asking us, you know, what type of [00:32:30] music. And some of them they know as well.

Payman Langroudi: Is it, is it, um, instrumental like no words. [00:32:35]

Deepa Patel: No words.

Payman Langroudi: Okay. So like sitars and whatever it.

Deepa Patel: Is and it’s so relaxing. They [00:32:40] love it.

Payman Langroudi: Like a spa feeling.

Deepa Patel: Spa.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Is like.

Deepa Patel: A.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, [00:32:45] yeah, yeah I get that. That’s nice. That’s nice.

Deepa Patel: Very good for the longer treatment and I think [00:32:50] uh, so I have one nurse she doesn’t like that much. So I always say you know what you want. And [00:32:55] she would she like, put radio on and it’s fine for me as well. But I think [00:33:00] one of my patients, she was asking like, do you charge the treatment? Like do you charge [00:33:05] for your singing into your treatment as well? And I said, no, no, no, this is this is just extra [00:33:10] for you and humming. Yeah. A lot of my patients, they said you are humming dentist [00:33:15] because.

Payman Langroudi: Humming Bombing dentist.

Deepa Patel: Yeah, I’m. I’m taking the tooth out, and I’m just humming [00:33:20] because I know that lyrics and patient just laughing. Recently we had a patient. He [00:33:25] it was his birthday and he said, I’m happy to take this tooth out if you don’t [00:33:30] mind. And we did it. And then I took it out and said, happy birthday to you like that. And he actually [00:33:35] wrote down in the review that he loved the whole experience. So I think [00:33:40] getting the personal touch in dentistry is for me is a key, obviously.

Payman Langroudi: Not [00:33:45] for everyone. Just start humming things interesting, isn’t it? It means the dentist is relaxed. The dentist, they tell me. [00:33:50] You know, that itself. It’s like every.

Deepa Patel: Patient walks in. They tell me that, you know, [00:33:55] because they’re like, I wish you will be my GP. I wish you will be my lab. And the [00:34:00] reason they say is because they can see how much I’m happy what I’m doing. They can tell [00:34:05] even again in review they say that, uh, he wrote it down. That dentist is going on a lot of [00:34:10] courses. He, she talked about to me, and I felt like I was not just [00:34:15] the patient. She talked about my family and she talked about her family. So when [00:34:20] I’m waiting for my LA to work, you know, when they come in. So we have this set of things, we talk about [00:34:25] holidays and, and, you know, just simple things. For example. Oh, I love that bracelet. And [00:34:30] she’s like, oh, this is from my great grandson or blah. So they have a story [00:34:35] to tell about the things. And it’s very simple. But the whole experience of that patient [00:34:40] coming into the chair even in ten minutes Check-up we talk a lot. We literally [00:34:45] talk a lot.

Payman Langroudi: So look, you go to a lot of practices where you must be exposed to a lot of different dentistry, [00:34:50] right. So you have to deal with whatever comes in front of you that day. Yes. So that could be [00:34:55] anything from a child to an implant case or, you know, [00:35:00] you must have been exposed to a lot of different things. And I guess that in one way makes you a better dentist because [00:35:05] you have to learn about those different things to, to.

Deepa Patel: I would definitely say that I have become more [00:35:10] better because of coming, because, for example, when I go to Bupa, I know what [00:35:15] is my day like. All I know, all my patients, I know the staff. When I go to locum, [00:35:20] anything.

Payman Langroudi: Could be.

Deepa Patel: Anything like first thing in the morning. Upper left seven root [00:35:25] canal. I never seen this patient before. Nervous patient. And that is [00:35:30] making me like, you know. Okay. And for example, patient had a feeling 3 or 4 times [00:35:35] before someone else. And now coming to me and all the same expectations from [00:35:40] them. And that is really helping me to become a better dentist every [00:35:45] single day.

Payman Langroudi: But you must have found yourself in some hairy situations as well. Um, like, did you [00:35:50] ever have a situation where, I don’t know, some implant, uh, was, uh, [00:35:55] was, uh, loose or, but then again, something like, like something where you didn’t know what to do because, [00:36:00] you know, we all know what to expect when you’re going into lots of different practices. Yeah. [00:36:05] Has that ever happened?

Deepa Patel: Uh.

Deepa Patel: So what happened is, uh, this is years ago. [00:36:10] Yeah. I’m talking about roughly 20, 1516 there was a patient Bupa locum [00:36:15] then, like hygienist I was doing, everybody came into me and they said, [00:36:20] oh, you know, this is difficult, patient. Blah, blah. She’ll demand so many things, [00:36:25] you know, just warning signs to me. And I’m like, okay, fine. So I spoke to her, um, [00:36:30] done the things for her. Just spend a few extra minutes. I don’t mind what time I finish, you know? For [00:36:35] me, it’s more important that that patient live happy. Yeah. You wouldn’t believe she [00:36:40] left the practice. And then she tried to find out where I am actually working as a, [00:36:45] you know, permanent dentist. She. I don’t know how she found me. I think probably on Facebook. [00:36:50] I don’t know. She came to that practice within six months. [00:36:55] And she’s like, now if you leave from here in case, I’ll try to find where you are. [00:37:00] So she’s still trying to.

Payman Langroudi: So that’s a happy story. I want a sad story.

Deepa Patel: Um. [00:37:05]

Deepa Patel: To be honest, not many. It just probably, again, because [00:37:10] every time they come in. Yeah. So when I think my listening [00:37:15] mode is becoming more and more and more better. So sometimes I feel like, [00:37:20] like a lot of patients comes in like discussing about they want ground or, you know, the difficulties, [00:37:25] for example, difficult cases in terms of clinical dentistry. I tell them the [00:37:30] ethical right things to do. Give them options. Be honest advantage [00:37:35] disadvantage, risk. And I never forced them you know do this do that [00:37:40] or this is important. I just say to them, if it’s my family sitting here, this is [00:37:45] the advice. I would give it to them entirely. Up to you. So I try not to put my [00:37:50] myself in the situation that it’s going more worse in the end.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, I know, but because [00:37:55] you’re in so many different places, so many different people, so many different treatments, the possibility of coming [00:38:00] across a difficult situation is much higher.

Deepa Patel: Higher, 100%.

Payman Langroudi: So this is what I’m saying. What were the difficult [00:38:05] situations so far?

Deepa Patel: It’s just sometimes, for example, difficult extraction, [00:38:10] difficult extraction. And I’m like, I don’t think so. This is going [00:38:15] to come out. But for me, surprisingly, it’s actually working. I thought, why [00:38:20] this dentist is giving me this patient to do this, this, this extractions. There is no [00:38:25] way I can do it. But when actually I do it. But informing the patient is more important [00:38:30] that see I will try my best to do this this this. Yeah. If it doesn’t work [00:38:35] or you know if the things doesn’t go the way we want it, this could be the option for you to do [00:38:40] it. And then I get that confidence to deal with that situation more better. And actually [00:38:45] I felt like I could do that as well, which I won’t do in Bupa if it my my own treatment [00:38:50] planning, I wouldn’t suggest that. I will say, you know, I’m referring you and [00:38:55] because of the low income, I’m just following everybody’s treatment planning that [00:39:00] is actually helping.

Payman Langroudi: That situation where you’ve come in to do [00:39:05] something, you’ve got the dentist treatment plan. You’re having to do something [00:39:10] and you totally disagree with what what he’s decided to to to do.

Deepa Patel: So then I had.

Payman Langroudi: That [00:39:15] must be an issue.

Deepa Patel: Right? I had, I had.

Payman Langroudi: So what do you do there.

Deepa Patel: So again I just be like [00:39:20] honest with the for example patient.

Payman Langroudi: You literally say I don’t agree with what you’re doing.

Deepa Patel: No, no, no I [00:39:25] don’t put it that way. The way I do is for example, I just say like this patient is so all [00:39:30] the time they book it as a review. So when I look into the x rays and, you know, check everything [00:39:35] and I feel like this is probably not the way, you know, for example, recently I had a patient, [00:39:40] she said she wants to go for extra. She was advised extraction. So there was no pain, no [00:39:45] problems. You know, everything was fine. So I just asked her a lot of questions and [00:39:50] she gave me the option and I realised that, you know, I won’t do extraction. So I said to patient [00:39:55] that, look, you’re not in pain. There is no infection or anything. What do you want [00:40:00] to do? You have option. I can just simply seal the tooth off for you. It’s a guarded [00:40:05] prognosis. But in the long term, you will have to remove the tooth if it’s giving you trouble or pain. It [00:40:10] was the only one molar left there. So if I remove that, she’s gonna struggle to eating. And [00:40:15] she really appreciated what I said to her. And she said, you know what? I would [00:40:20] love to try what you said. So again, the way you put the things in that okay, I [00:40:25] understand so and so dentist advise you this to me. These are the things I feel [00:40:30] could be you’re.

Payman Langroudi: Comfortable with that.

Deepa Patel: Very, very comfortable. I think again because [00:40:35] of the history of, uh, you know, having all this experience. Experience [00:40:40] is helping me so much. And she was very happy when she [00:40:45] left. And she, she obviously, if you think yourself as a patient, you coming for extraction and you [00:40:50] have a fear that you don’t have any more teeth left to eat on that side, and now you say, [00:40:55] okay, I can probably keep that for another five years. So there will be every [00:41:00] time every dentist will have, for example, they say, yeah, they said there is a caries [00:41:05] underneath the filling, but for me, I might not be saying the same. I would say, you know, I wouldn’t [00:41:10] touch that deep. Close to deep amalgam filling close to the now remove [00:41:15] that and end into the pulpal involvement, root canal and extraction. So I would say [00:41:20] there is a chance they will need replacement, but there is a risk. So [00:41:25] the way you explain, I think a lot of people or dentists do feel [00:41:30] that they don’t give the information to the patient. They think it’s too much. But [00:41:35] for me, the communication, the information is the key because they know [00:41:40] the whole picture and they trust. That’s why I get the trust from the patient that okay, you know [00:41:45] what? She she has explained me the whole thing and truth the ethical [00:41:50] way. And they’re like, okay, fine. I know I would love to go for this [00:41:55] option. And then I document everything, make sure everything written and I say patient is [00:42:00] aware what will be the long term and.

Payman Langroudi: The locum life. It [00:42:05] must have some advantages. Inasmuch as you can be, let’s say one week. Your [00:42:10] kid needs you more. You don’t have to work that week, right? It’s very flexible in that sense.

Deepa Patel: And this is the reason [00:42:15] I do.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Deepa Patel: This is so like summer holidays now.

Payman Langroudi: But also you have to [00:42:20] drive distances surely.

Deepa Patel: No no no. I don’t choose the long distance.

Payman Langroudi: You’re within sort of what. [00:42:25] Yeah. 40 minutes or whatever you decide.

Deepa Patel: So if you see the Derbyshire is beautiful driving. Yeah, yeah.

Payman Langroudi: So [00:42:30] you stick to near your house. Yeah. And there’s enough workers there if you want to.

Deepa Patel: It’s more than enough.

Payman Langroudi: Oh, okay. [00:42:35]

Deepa Patel: I have to say no.

Payman Langroudi: Cool cool cool.

Deepa Patel: So I have to say no. And I work over weekends as well. [00:42:40] Sometimes.

Payman Langroudi: So tell me. Tell me about, you know, motherhood. Um, [00:42:45] you know, this notion of having it all from the. It’s very difficult as [00:42:50] a mother. It’s very difficult because you have to sort of. Do you have the guilt question with your kids [00:42:55] that you’re not spending enough time with them? Sometimes, these sort of things. How old are your kids?

Deepa Patel: So [00:43:00] my.

Payman Langroudi: 216 because of.

Deepa Patel: For Empire. And how so? [00:43:05] Okay. Two of them, boy and girl. So I would say I’ve been very lucky in [00:43:10] terms of my husband being very flexible.

Payman Langroudi: He works from home. Does he? Yeah.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. [00:43:15] So I don’t remember when I had to go home and cancel my patients in the [00:43:20] last six years, which is amazing. And again, I’ve been blessed in terms of [00:43:25] I know it’s a Covid, but again, I had enough time with them until now. [00:43:30] You know, like two years of nice break.

Payman Langroudi: So, for instance, during the school holidays, do you work [00:43:35] a lot less? Is that how you do it?

Deepa Patel: Like this whole summer holidays, I’ve been all the time outside. [00:43:40] Like I’m not working much.

Payman Langroudi: That is nice.

Deepa Patel: When they go to school, I’m not sitting [00:43:45] home. I just go and work. And I think Bupa gave me a really good flexibility. [00:43:50] So I start at ten. So 1:00 I have lunch break for one hour and then 2 to 5. So [00:43:55] three hours, three hours, six hours. And I’m done.

Payman Langroudi: And Bupa you tell me about Bupa as [00:44:00] far as working in a corporate because some people are worried about.

Deepa Patel: They don’t like.

Payman Langroudi: It. Some people worry [00:44:05] about corporates I think is a bit different to most of the corporates. But what [00:44:10] are your reflections?

Deepa Patel: I love it.

Payman Langroudi: Do you, do you?

Deepa Patel: I love it. Um, I think again [00:44:15] it depends on what practice you are, how the team are. My team is dream team. I can tell you that [00:44:20] dream team as soon as I walk in. I just love it. So I never, [00:44:25] you know, a lot of people. I had this, uh, the podcast, I was listening, and they were talking [00:44:30] about the work life balance thing. I never had that situation. Work life balance thing. [00:44:35] The work life balance you need when you don’t like what you do, [00:44:40] you know, you feel like you’re forced to go somewhere where you don’t like it. For me, it’s [00:44:45] not the case. As soon as I walk in, I’m done. I’m not. I’m switching [00:44:50] myself into dentistry. My patients, my. You know, the team.

Payman Langroudi: Is it? It’s [00:44:55] easier doing dentistry than being a mother. No.

Deepa Patel: Uh, no, I love both.

Payman Langroudi: But [00:45:00] which is easier.

Deepa Patel: Um, I think dentistry.

Payman Langroudi: Me too.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. [00:45:05] You got two kids as well, so.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, well, I’m not [00:45:10] the mother, but. Yeah, I don’t know, man. Dentistry. At least you know what’s what. Whereas with kids, you have to, like, [00:45:15] constantly.

Deepa Patel: It’s a constant. So before, you know. Uh, I [00:45:20] had my daughter bulimia. I thought I wouldn’t be a good mother. And I thought, you know, [00:45:25] like keeping a kid for one one hour. Two hours is a different story when you have 24 [00:45:30] over seven, a lot of demanding. And this is why I would say I’ve been very blessed with my [00:45:35] understanding. Like, the husband is like, your partner is very [00:45:40] important.

Payman Langroudi: Definitely.

Deepa Patel: So if I say I have like for example, podcast today, he is looking after [00:45:45] the kids. So that’s support. So he uh like both of us, we work [00:45:50] around. So when he’s not busy, I’ll take lukewarm. When he’s busy [00:45:55] I don’t take lukewarm. So we’re not losing any financial Stuff. But [00:46:00] still, our kids always have someone, either me or my husband. And as you [00:46:05] mentioned, the mother guild. You know, when you go to work leaving your one year or two years old. [00:46:10]

Payman Langroudi: A lot of it, people sitting where you’re sitting.

Deepa Patel: 100%.

Payman Langroudi: Guilty.

Deepa Patel: 100%. [00:46:15] And I have colleagues actually went for maternity and they come back and when I talk to them, they have [00:46:20] the same thing. For example, your kid getting something from nursery and then you go and then you have to [00:46:25] stay home with them or you staying home because you know. Well, yeah. So again you have a [00:46:30] guilt of that. You not able to justify your patience. You’re not able to justify [00:46:35] your but that balance if you know that it’s okay. Before [00:46:40] I was struggling a lot, you know before I had this workshops done, [00:46:45] three years of my volunteering, I would say I was not able to accept the things. [00:46:50] Now I’m like, it’s okay if it’s not well, he’s not well, you [00:46:55] know, before it’s like, why he’s not well, why we didn’t look after or [00:47:00] why he.

Payman Langroudi: Didn’t end up being kinder to yourself sort of thing. Is that the kind of thing we’re talking about?

Deepa Patel: Yes. [00:47:05] I love my me time. So I have one weekday off. [00:47:10] When kids go to school, I sit down with my books, and every week I [00:47:15] reflect my week in the last week. I learned this from one of the [00:47:20] book I was reading about it. The reflection is very important. When [00:47:25] you don’t reflect. You are like walking in the tunnel. There is no light. But when I go [00:47:30] back and reflect, you know, that’s last week or whatever, there were a lot of important things which we couldn’t [00:47:35] do it. So before I was not able to accept being a perfect personality, I’m like, it has [00:47:40] to be done. But now I’m like, it’s okay. It’s not being done. Accept it. [00:47:45] And that really helps. We, me and my husband, we went to last year to meditation [00:47:50] course for ten days and that has changed our life again. So no. [00:47:55]

Payman Langroudi: What did you do with the kids?

Deepa Patel: So I went first.

Payman Langroudi: Okay.

Deepa Patel: So he he [00:48:00] saw I think it was very good for me. So he booked myself and I booked [00:48:05] him. So we gave a gift to each.

Payman Langroudi: One of these silent retreats. Yes.

Deepa Patel: Silent ten. [00:48:10]

Payman Langroudi: Days. Didn’t talk for ten days.

Deepa Patel: And no phone.

Payman Langroudi: And just meditated the whole time.

Deepa Patel: 16 hours a [00:48:15] day.

Payman Langroudi: Oh my God. So go on. I’ve had. I’ve had other people go. Friends of mine done that. How does [00:48:20] it leave you? You come out clearer.

Deepa Patel: I think the my whole inner at [00:48:25] that time, I think I was 38 or my whole 30 years, 38 years just [00:48:30] gone from, you know, one like from my childhood till today, all the things you [00:48:35] know, happen in my life. It just came like a big picture in front of me. Because [00:48:40] you don’t have anybody to talk. You you talk to yourself. Yeah. And they say, [00:48:45] you know, you you suppress a lot of things. Like nowadays, I see, and I feel bad for the [00:48:50] dentist and a lot of stuff. They have so much stress going on all the time. Stress about [00:48:55] a lot of things. And for me, that retreat was really good because the way [00:49:00] they teach you that everything is impermanent. I’m sitting with you now. Right [00:49:05] now, my moment is with you. No, Payman, I’m talking about the thing. It’s my podcast. [00:49:10] I’m not worried about the past. I’m not worried about what will happen afterwards. I’m just living [00:49:15] in the moment because of that retreat. So before I was like, I’m here. [00:49:20] But then I’m thinking, oh, when I’m gonna finish what I’m gonna do next. The all the time, next, next, [00:49:25] next.

Deepa Patel: I’m in Switzerland. But then I’m thinking about what? About my next holiday. So I was never [00:49:30] into the moment. And now I’m. If, you know, I came for course. The [00:49:35] train was cancelled the next day. There was a problem with the travelling before. If it [00:49:40] was me before three years or even last retreat, I’ll be like stressed [00:49:45] and, you know, regretting and angry. Now I’m like, it’s okay. [00:49:50] Just five minutes late. You know, it’s not. I’m not gonna going to miss the whole day. [00:49:55] I’m still going. So I’m being grateful. So that’s what I do as well. So [00:50:00] they said everything is impermanent. Whether it’s a good time or bad time, it’s on [00:50:05] you. Do you want to stay in that moment? And that’s why I love my dentistry. On that day, [00:50:10] I never check my diary ahead. I don’t check next day. What’s happening? No I don’t. I just [00:50:15] even I don’t check my day a lot of a lot of time. My nurse telling me you have this patient coming in the [00:50:20] afternoon, you know that. Oh, yes. Yes. So that is.

Payman Langroudi: Living in the moment, isn’t it?

Deepa Patel: It is, [00:50:25] but it helps. Otherwise, you’re stressing too much about tomorrow. There is few places or [00:50:30] whatever spaces. And why would I care about that?

Payman Langroudi: Do they teach you to meditate?

Deepa Patel: Yes. [00:50:35] So it’s nothing. It’s just you sit down and breathe. Breathe. That’s it. [00:50:40]

Payman Langroudi: That’s it.

Deepa Patel: That’s.

Payman Langroudi: It. For ten days.

Deepa Patel: And I.

Payman Langroudi: Didn’t. So interesting. So what goes? What happens [00:50:45] in day one? Day two, day nine, day ten. Like what emotions go through you.

Deepa Patel: So the [00:50:50] whole ten days designed by. You know, that person who has developed [00:50:55] the whole technique is based on the Buddhism but is not related to religion. Anyone can do it [00:51:00] and you’ll be surprised that there is a waiting list for this.

Payman Langroudi: Is waiting list become very [00:51:05] popular?

Deepa Patel: Yeah, yeah, and I actually got my place in waiting. Even my husband got placed in waiting. [00:51:10] So it’s just someone cancel. You go. So ten days, the [00:51:15] first day, they start with, you know, telling you just concentrate on breathing. First day, second day, [00:51:20] a bit more, deeper.

Payman Langroudi: Deeper in a.

Deepa Patel: Group. 150 female, 50 male altogether. [00:51:25] All together.

Payman Langroudi: Okay.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. And then you wake up at four, you start your meditation. They [00:51:30] provide you breakfast, lunch and dinner, just the fruits and stuff. But the more important thing [00:51:35] for me to stay for that ten days was really [00:51:40] hard living. Two kids behind and you know, and then my emotions like whatever [00:51:45] the things or mistakes I have done in my life, in personal or anywhere, [00:51:50] it just came up. You know all the things.

Payman Langroudi: Which day? Which day did that start happening?

Deepa Patel: Uh, [00:51:55] third. Fourth day. So they say the sixth day is more difficult because [00:52:00] everything come up on the surface. And a lot of people cry. I cried [00:52:05] as well. I know you feel.

Payman Langroudi: Are you constantly with loads of people or are you on your own? Sometimes.

Deepa Patel: Sometimes [00:52:10] you’re on your own. You don’t have to be in that room like the big hall for all the time. [00:52:15] You only have to be like 3 or 4 hours a day. You have a flexibility. No one is telling [00:52:20] you to do that.

Payman Langroudi: Is it physically difficult? Like you’re on your own?

Deepa Patel: Sometimes people complain about [00:52:25] the back pain, but they do provide you support for that as well. But it’s my [00:52:30] again my mentor. He told me very one small advice that, you know, don’t leave, [00:52:35] don’t don’t leave like don’t leave midway. Don’t come out of that finish. [00:52:40] Yeah. Complete it. And that was my head all the time. You know I’m gonna finish. [00:52:45] But the the the best part of the whole day was in the evening. There was a lecture [00:52:50] In that lecture he will explain to you. What did you feel all day? Why did you [00:52:55] feel it? And how to, you know, get that better every day?

Payman Langroudi: All this [00:53:00] time you’re not allowed to talk to anyone else?

Deepa Patel: No, no. Completely. Silence. Yeah. [00:53:05]

Payman Langroudi: What do you. But it’s so interesting.

Deepa Patel: A lot of authors go there. A lot of popular [00:53:10] celebrities, they go there because. Can you see this world going the way it is all the time [00:53:15] on the phone? Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Deepa Patel: Uh, constant mental. Like, you know, you look. I [00:53:20] feel like a robot all the time. You know, constant, like a home mom [00:53:25] duties, you know, household stuff.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. There’s loads of. I mean, your phone, there’s loads of stuff constantly. [00:53:30] You’re getting your attention. Completely. Distraction.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. So you [00:53:35] meet yourself, basically. And when I did that, you know, and they teach [00:53:40] you this is the very coming back to my patients again. So when patient is being angry [00:53:45] or rude that teaching from vipassana meditation is telling me deeper. Be [00:53:50] nice, you know. Be kind. You know there is a reason. [00:53:55] And show your empathy, sympathy, everything. That quality is [00:54:00] really helping me. I have patients coming in crying. They have cancer, they [00:54:05] have some lot of family issues. And they come and they cry and they. And I [00:54:10] am a hugger person. So I always give them a hug and they finish. I have treated patients [00:54:15] in the normal chair, not on the dental chair. I have done extraction, I have done denture fit because [00:54:20] patient was literally not able to come into the room. She’s like, I’m not coming. And [00:54:25] she said, I took 1 or 2 weeks to prepare myself to come in here. [00:54:30] So if you think about.

Payman Langroudi: All these patients.

Deepa Patel: All these men, you know, the mental, um, like [00:54:35] difficulties for patients to treat, dentistry is not different. Sorry. [00:54:40] Difficult I would say is treating patient is more difficult. And this all [00:54:45] things what I’m doing in the background. So a lot of people think that, you know, she does so much, [00:54:50] so many things and they don’t realise the importance of that in my dentistry because [00:54:55] they haven’t done it. But if they would, I have so many friends. They actually [00:55:00] done the personality awareness workshop along with me. I told them, do you want to do it? And [00:55:05] they did it and they’re like, lovely, I want to do it again. And they’re like, do you want to be my mentor? [00:55:10] Do you want to talk to me about the things you know? Can you teach me how to live [00:55:15] happy and peaceful and, you know, all the time the energy level? I’m [00:55:20] always like this. Even I’m not. Well, I’m my level. High energy level is always [00:55:25] up and talking to everybody. Patients, staff just [00:55:30] need so much energy and passing on that positive energy for patients [00:55:35] like they know they have so much going on. And if you just say, you know, everything will be fine, that [00:55:40] that reassurance from you, it makes a huge difference. So I think [00:55:45] I always say to my staff and my mentors, you know, I don’t do dental [00:55:50] health issue. I deal with the dental and mental health issue together.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. [00:55:55]

Deepa Patel: And and that is actually a key to success because.

Payman Langroudi: Look, [00:56:00] listen, my wife did an operation. We picked the guy we liked the most. Yeah. [00:56:05] Not not based on his. I mean, we did. We knew they were all good guys, but in the end, it [00:56:10] was a big operation. It wasn’t a filling. Yeah. No, we ended up picking the guy we liked. Yeah, and [00:56:15] it’s not like you’re even awake during the operation, right? No. So it goes a long way. Like the [00:56:20] guy who felt like he understood us. You know.

Deepa Patel: You feel that confident when you talk to them? [00:56:25]

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Deepa Patel: The vibe.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Deepa Patel: The vibe you get in. As you said, when you walk into the practice, [00:56:30] you know, you feel like I want this. I want to come.

Payman Langroudi: Back to those initial things. Let’s talk about [00:56:35] sort of the darker side any time. What comes to mind when I say was who was your [00:56:40] most difficult patient?

Deepa Patel: Um, like in terms of [00:56:45] the treating there, like in terms of the clinical or just dealing [00:56:50] with them.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, I mean, it tends to be dealing with them that becomes the issue. But but either either [00:56:55] I mean what tends to happen is something clinically goes wrong. Yeah. And then the patient overreacts [00:57:00] to it or something. Yeah. And then that turns into a complaint or turns into [00:57:05] a situation. Loss of loss of confidence.

Deepa Patel: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: What comes to mind when I say [00:57:10] that.

Deepa Patel: I had, um, one obviously it was not much [00:57:15] clinical, but it was about the referring the patient. And, um, I literally [00:57:20] just procrastinated my stuff and it was a bit delayed. And then he ended up doing [00:57:25] the complain about it. So first stage I was just like, you know, stress. But it was [00:57:30] not clinical. So I was not much, you know.

Payman Langroudi: Oh, you were supposed to send a referral, but you hadn’t.

Deepa Patel: Uh, [00:57:35] it just it was it took longer because it was a transition between the paper and the [00:57:40] electronic, and I was going on maternity, so it was just so much going on. But I learned [00:57:45] from that mistake. And nowadays, what I do is it was resolved. [00:57:50] It was resolved.

Payman Langroudi: Was it like. What was it like an oral surgery?

Deepa Patel: No no no no. It was just a root canal. [00:57:55] So I did stage one already, but I couldn’t find all the canals.

Payman Langroudi: So send me to an Endodontist.

Deepa Patel: Yes, [00:58:00] yes, yes.

Payman Langroudi: And then he goes, where’s my referral?

Deepa Patel: Uh, so he’s like, you [00:58:05] know, like why I didn’t hear anything about it. But then I rectified [00:58:10] those things and he was happy in the end.

Payman Langroudi: And you learned not to make that mistake again.

Deepa Patel: I [00:58:15] think, uh, definitely in terms of again, I look back and [00:58:20] I see, okay, this is my mistake. And nowadays, what I do straight in front of the patient, [00:58:25] I just refer them straight away. So if they say I want ortho, [00:58:30] it doesn’t take more than one minute. But again, it’s all about you. Being efficient [00:58:35] is more important. And now I learned this. And before again, I was just [00:58:40] building up a lot of work. You know, it’s admin. So much admin along with the dentist, like [00:58:45] in a lab thing, sending the pictures of the patients every single day. Once [00:58:50] you finish with the patients, you have so much to follow up. So now I’m just making a list on [00:58:55] my list in a day list and straight away, okay, take.

Payman Langroudi: The one thing I’m happiest about not [00:59:00] practising anymore is that yeah, I don’t have.

Deepa Patel: You don’t miss.

Payman Langroudi: The admin. [00:59:05] No. Well, the admin when I was a dentist wasn’t as bad. No. Yeah. We used to do like exam nad [00:59:10] that. Was it finished. That was the whole examination on the, [00:59:15] in the notes.

Deepa Patel: I have seen, I have seen when I was working uh Oliver in UK, I’m [00:59:20] talking about 2016 and I went one practice. They still using the paper one. Yeah. [00:59:25] 2016. Yeah. And I had to write.

Payman Langroudi: Down NHS.

Deepa Patel: Things. Yeah. Brown and then white papers [00:59:30] in the private. And I had to write everything every time with the pen and I’m like [00:59:35] okay. But there are a lot of dentists. They obviously if you’re retiring, do you bother to go back [00:59:40] to, you know, the electric and notes. But these days I think all the softwares [00:59:45] are amazing. There are a lot of help, but I think I learned from my mistake very, very, [00:59:50] uh, like, efficiently.

Payman Langroudi: I mean, how long do you stay after your last [00:59:55] patient leaves? Just doing the admin bits.

Deepa Patel: Before I used to. I used to do [01:00:00] a lot, I’m telling you, like we had access to Dental from home as well, but I’m very thankful [01:00:05] to my manager. She said you’re not doing that. She said, um, she’s [01:00:10] amazing. She said to me, do you really want text from the practice when you’re not in the practice? [01:00:15] And I said, no, actually not. So I said, why do you bother to answer if someone is asking you? [01:00:20] I said, that’s true. She said no to everyone that you’re not gonna text anything. [01:00:25] You know, when she comes back. Only that’s the time you only talk to her. And this is amazing. She [01:00:30] taught me.

Payman Langroudi: That’s my I hate that that’s my bugbear. Is it? Yeah. [01:00:35] Like I want to be able to WhatsApp any member of staff at midnight. No no no no no [01:00:40] no.

Deepa Patel: That it’s in a nice way. It’s good I can do that. But what I, what [01:00:45] she doesn’t want me to do is like, you know, take work home.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. What a what a good manager [01:00:50] though. One thing about corporates, though, is that the manager [01:00:55] is all powerful.

Deepa Patel: She’s amazing.

Payman Langroudi: I mean, so she’s amazing. So you’re having an amazing experience [01:01:00] in Bupa? Yeah.

Deepa Patel: She is one of the best I could have in in independence. [01:01:05]

Payman Langroudi: The principle is all powerful. Yeah. So you know at the end of the day it depends on some someone’s [01:01:10] power. Yeah.

Deepa Patel: Yeah you are right. Like because I’ve worked in corporates and independent [01:01:15] that when you go in an independent you, you will not much talk to manager. It’s all about [01:01:20] the principle that is coming to you and asking a lot of things to do. You know, do this do that.

Payman Langroudi: But [01:01:25] what comes to mind, what comes to mind when I say, what’s your best lecture you’ve ever been to?

Deepa Patel: I [01:01:30] would say, uh, recently actually BDA uh, profit an occlusion. [01:01:35] It was only 45 minutes, but the way he started, he said, you [01:01:40] cannot learn occlusion in 45 minutes, but I’ll try to fit in. I love that, [01:01:45] and I think because I’m doing composites now, you know, even I see a lot [01:01:50] of patients implant from other colleagues and stuff and from my mistakes in [01:01:55] terms, not mistakes. But when you see someone coming back one or 2 or 3 times for lost filling, [01:02:00] that means there is something which you’re not really looking into. So from the occlusion lecture, [01:02:05] I realised that there are so many things, like the whole dentistry around the occlusion. Yeah, [01:02:10] if you’re not getting occlusion right, even though you have paid or got £3,000 for implant, it’s not going [01:02:15] to it’s going to fail. So that’s the definitely one good. [01:02:20]

Payman Langroudi: Lecture that stands.

Deepa Patel: Out. I, I would love to work on more and more on that so I [01:02:25] could do more better dentistry in the other like build ups and everything better.

Payman Langroudi: Um, [01:02:30] what about a resource like a book, a website, a social media, something that [01:02:35] you, you know, like, stands out as far as.

Deepa Patel: Uh. So again, I [01:02:40] would be very thankful to you that you told us in the course that, you know, like, you [01:02:45] have your own social media stuff. I didn’t have before. That’s the day when I started. [01:02:50]

Payman Langroudi: When you started from.

Deepa Patel: Msn. So many smile makeover is one. [01:02:55]

Payman Langroudi: So interesting. You actually did it first.

Deepa Patel: Real, first real.

Payman Langroudi: I did it. Imagine, like so [01:03:00] many people were in that room who still haven’t done it, like the execution is. Yeah.

Deepa Patel: And you say [01:03:05] to me that like to us that, you know, you are afraid of other dentists, [01:03:10] not the patients. For example, if I’m putting a picture or a video or [01:03:15] something on there, I’ll be thinking more about what the perfect dentist will talk about. Like, [01:03:20] this is rubbish. You know what you’re doing. There is no line angle on your what?

Payman Langroudi: You understand this?

Deepa Patel: This is what [01:03:25] I mean. So this was taking the things back to me, but now I’m like, I’m not really, you know, bothered. [01:03:30]

Payman Langroudi: I just imagine if you were the top dentist in the UK. Yeah. The top dentist in the UK [01:03:35] is not the top dentist in the world. No. Maybe.

Deepa Patel: No. There is always.

Payman Langroudi: Someone that cat has to [01:03:40] worry about. Some guy in Brazil looking at his work. I agree. So we all have that in the end. Every every [01:03:45] dentist has got some other dentist they’re worried about. Yeah. You know, is that guy going to respect my [01:03:50] work? Yeah, but it’s not. We’re not unless you want. Unless you’re unless you’re selling to dentists. [01:03:55]

Deepa Patel: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Then you don’t need to worry. About what the dentist and I like. I like you. I [01:04:00] was on your page, actually. I like the fact that there’s just so many reviews in there. Just like every every third post [01:04:05] is a review.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. So I love. Uh, so I got this idea again from a lot of my different [01:04:10] local places, like a makeover Monday. So I put my pictures from, uh, [01:04:15] Testimony Tuesday. So that’s where you see my every Tuesday there is a test.

Payman Langroudi: So that’s [01:04:20] the sort of the rhythm of your posting. I have a rhythm in posting.

Deepa Patel: I love it because then it [01:04:25] reminds me if it’s Wednesday, it reminds me that, you know, not random things. I just know, oh, Workaholic [01:04:30] Wednesday or wonderful Wednesday Wednesday. And that is.

Payman Langroudi: Actually the really cool thing about it [01:04:35] is if you then you know you need for testimony Tuesdays every every [01:04:40] month. Yeah. You need for Workaholic Wednesdays. Yeah. You could sit in one day and do all of that. Yeah. [01:04:45] You don’t have to on every Wednesday. Think of something.

Deepa Patel: No, no, no, I love I love photography [01:04:50] in general. Forget about dentistry, I love it. You know, I.

Payman Langroudi: Saw you did the course, Dinesh Patel.

Deepa Patel: Did [01:04:55] you.

Payman Langroudi: Did you enjoy.

Deepa Patel: That? Yeah, I went there, I loved it.

Payman Langroudi: I can’t persuade him to come on this podcast. [01:05:00] Isn’t it funny? Like some people, some people contact me through a PR company and say, [01:05:05] I’ll pay you to have this person on. And then other people like Dinesh.

Deepa Patel: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Can’t [01:05:10] get him on. He doesn’t want to. Doesn’t want to talk about himself.

Deepa Patel: He’s very nice.

Payman Langroudi: He’s sweet. He’s he’s.

Deepa Patel: Very [01:05:15] sweet. And I would say because I love photography and he works for Bupa as well. So he was very good. [01:05:20] And so again like Transformation Thursday or [01:05:25] you know, thriving Thursday. Fantastic Friday is my favourite because Friday I’m Friday.

Payman Langroudi: So [01:05:30] what happens on the fantastic Friday.

Deepa Patel: It just we we chill. Friday is my [01:05:35] private day anyways, so the nurses love it because Wednesday is my NHS day so they [01:05:40] are literally on their toes all the time. Whereas the Friday is so nice and because it’s [01:05:45] longer appointments and I love this. We recently started doing this before I had a mixed [01:05:50] things and it was really stressful. You know, like for example, if you’re getting your cameras [01:05:55] out, you know, your loops, a lot of things. So when my private is all one day and [01:06:00] you know what you’re doing, your, your your mind is ready for that. So Wednesday [01:06:05] I know is going to be busy day. So we prepared that in our head like a lot of emergency whatever. [01:06:10] So it’s just.

Payman Langroudi: Like you love the variety.

Deepa Patel: I love it.

Payman Langroudi: Because if it [01:06:15] was me, I would want Friday every day.

Deepa Patel: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: You know what I mean? I you know, [01:06:20] it sounds Friday to me out of that lot. Friday sounds like the best day.

Deepa Patel: But I [01:06:25] have I think Friday is a day when a lot of people I have patients, they work Monday to Thursday in [01:06:30] London. On Friday is the day when they only can do so. I actually had a lot of patients from my colleague. [01:06:35] They didn’t check ups and they’re doing treatment with me on Friday because I’m the only one who is available on that day. [01:06:40] So it’s again how you look for your inner opportunities, opportunities and [01:06:45] stuff. And yeah, I think I love it. I think it’s [01:06:50] just overall I love dentistry and I love this.

Payman Langroudi: So what if there [01:06:55] were no time or money constraints? What would be a course you would jump into? [01:07:00] Like what? More occlusion? Maybe Frank spear, [01:07:05] John Kois those ones in America. The big, the big mouth.

Deepa Patel: I would love to travel [01:07:10] like a dentist. The dentist they do like, do they go all over? Now, [01:07:15] the dentistry is not just UK or India or, you know, it’s all over. It’s global.

Payman Langroudi: So [01:07:20] is there a course that you would jump into if you had nothing else to do?

Deepa Patel: More Invisalign? Oh, yeah, [01:07:25] because that’s what I just started. You know, until you do it, you don’t know whether you can [01:07:30] do it. And I’ve just done a liner course as well.

Payman Langroudi: So that’s with Rampton and his brother. Yeah, yeah. [01:07:35] Good course was on that. My wife was on that. Yeah.

Deepa Patel: They both I think uh, [01:07:40] to me any course doesn’t matter. You know who’s delivering or anything. There [01:07:45] are so many good courses these days if you see like for example, if I want to do online course, I have [01:07:50] so many varieties, it’s not like one online course is going on at the moment the way it is.

Payman Langroudi: There’s a lot [01:07:55] going on.

Deepa Patel: A lot of and I would say, I wouldn’t say that this one is best and this one is not, because [01:08:00] everyone is delivering the almost same principle. It’s all about how much you say, [01:08:05] like MSM, I was all the time, you know, trying to take for it. Yeah, yeah, go [01:08:10] for it.

Payman Langroudi: So we should come back.

Deepa Patel: You. I’m coming.

Payman Langroudi: Oh you win.

Deepa Patel: I’m coming. September.

Payman Langroudi: London. [01:08:15]

Deepa Patel: I’m taking two days off. Brilliant. So I’ll be there.

Payman Langroudi: Brilliant.

Deepa Patel: So I think again [01:08:20] with the MSM, I learned a lot of things. But I think again, [01:08:25] you forget over the time.

Payman Langroudi: Repetition is important too.

Deepa Patel: And I love this about. [01:08:30] This is what I didn’t know until I did MSM that I can come back. But when I saw the people sitting next [01:08:35] to you.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, yeah.

Deepa Patel: Yeah. Like why are they sitting? Then I understood that, you know, you can go back. And I [01:08:40] think.

Payman Langroudi: We gave that enlightened kit. Did you use it? Yes, yes. And did [01:08:45] you then continue with enlightened or. No.

Deepa Patel: So we’re trying to get the things in our practice as [01:08:50] well. But a lot of practices, they’re already doing it. And that’s the one thing we so we got in contact with everybody [01:08:55] in here as well that we want to do more. Because again I want to not just say okay, [01:09:00] you want this one, two, three options for patients. Tell them the what is the advantage and [01:09:05] let them choose give give all the varieties. So with the same with the Invisalign onlays. [01:09:10] And this is why I want to go as many as courses I could do if the time [01:09:15] and money not constant. But I think a lot of people think that going on the course and paying [01:09:20] money is not the good investment, but to me it’s the best investment.

Payman Langroudi: It’s the one [01:09:25] thing, the sort of the health warning I would put on it is it’s not the end. It’s the beginning. [01:09:30] You know, like if you went on this liner course. Yeah, that’s not the end of your liner [01:09:35] journey, like, you know, or if you come on MSM, you’re gonna have to practice, practice [01:09:40] and.

Deepa Patel: Put the knowledge you take on that day.

Payman Langroudi: To practice.

Deepa Patel: Yeah, implement onto [01:09:45] your routine. And if you don’t do that, then you actually that’s those people actually feel [01:09:50] that it was a waste of time and money. But for people who really take the things and my friends [01:09:55] coming as well, MSM. So that’s why I’m joining them. So it’ll be nice. This is how I like. [01:10:00]

Payman Langroudi: The dinner as well. Make sure you come for the dinner.

Deepa Patel: Yeah, it’s a networking.

Payman Langroudi: A massive pleasure having [01:10:05] you. I really enjoyed it.

Deepa Patel: I love it, I will just say the last thing is, um, I do a lot of gratitude [01:10:10] practice. Gratitude practice?

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. So I [01:10:15] spell it out every day.

Deepa Patel: Yes. I write ten gratitude a day in the morning first [01:10:20] thing. And that really helps me to look the positive things throughout the day. So [01:10:25] being a perfect you, the way I do is look negative a lot around me, but [01:10:30] that was not helping me because, you know, I just become upset and angry and everything. Now, [01:10:35] I started writing gratitude for the last three years, ten in the morning. So it’s all about [01:10:40] trying to see good in you, good in everything, good in the course, everywhere. Just good. [01:10:45] Yeah, yeah. You have negative, but you’re not looking into.

Payman Langroudi: Also, I’ve found the best [01:10:50] way to get through a difficult time in your life. The only way actually, it’s only [01:10:55] only way. The only way to get through something difficult, whatever the difficulty is, is [01:11:00] to look at the gratitude side.

Deepa Patel: Being being grateful. Being thankful is not harmful at all. [01:11:05] And my kids, they do gratitude practice with me.

Payman Langroudi: Really? Really.

Deepa Patel: So they say, thank you mommy. [01:11:10] You know, for this as a thank you is the word we use most of the time. And even my nurses, [01:11:15] my patients all the time, just being thankful for everything what I have in [01:11:20] my life. And that’s probably one of the reasons for my happiness. You know, the way I [01:11:25] live my life is all about even difficult situations, difficult problems, even [01:11:30] difficult patients. I actually write down on my list every day that thank you, thank [01:11:35] you, thank you. My all patients are happy. I finish everything on time and I [01:11:40] had a great day. So that’s my start of the day. So that’s my imagination, my manifestation, [01:11:45] my inner positivity before even I start.

Payman Langroudi: You’ve got brilliant outlook, man. [01:11:50] You’ve got brilliant outlook because I keep on trying to take you to negative places and you just won’t do it. You [01:11:55] will not do it. It’s just it’s. And I think that’s the thing I’ve learned the most from talking [01:12:00] to you like that, you know, like irrepressible positivity, but so important. [01:12:05]

Deepa Patel: Don’t you think, that, you know, when you have a difficult time, you, I’m sure you had in your life and you [01:12:10] would probably have it. But if you think positive about the things, the things [01:12:15] the situation is same. The people are the same, the patients are the same. Yeah. The only thing [01:12:20] I’m changing is myself. The way I look at. Yeah, yeah. And I’m taking 100% responsibility [01:12:25] of everything. I’m not blaming nurse. I’m not blaming manager. I’m not blaming patient. I’m [01:12:30] just thinking, how could I be better than yesterday? You know, from yesterday I [01:12:35] was something wrong, 10% wrong. How could I rectify that 10%? No others. [01:12:40] If I focus on others, I’ll be really upset.

Payman Langroudi: I think I’m going to look at [01:12:45] the silent retreat as well. It’s funny because I’ve asked loads of people about that. I’ve got loads of friends [01:12:50] who’ve been on it, but and I never thought it was something I want to do. But the way you explained it, that [01:12:55] sounds really.

Deepa Patel: Good. It’s a life changing experience for me for sure. And I’m going serving [01:13:00] again. I’m going to serving again so you can serve only when you have done ten days.

Payman Langroudi: Oh, really? [01:13:05]

Deepa Patel: And you cannot donate until you have done it.

Payman Langroudi: Nice.

Deepa Patel: So if you have £1 million, you say, I [01:13:10] want to contribute in other people. You can’t. You have to go through that [01:13:15] ten days. Know yourself first in coming to that stage where [01:13:20] you can actually help others. And that’s my motive Like I want to be remembered. [01:13:25] Like, you know, happy, helpful, positive person rather than miserable. [01:13:30]

Payman Langroudi: You’re not miserable. I’ll tell you that. It’s been a [01:13:35] massive pleasure. Thank you so much for coming. Thank you so.

Deepa Patel: Much for having me.

[VOICE]: This [01:13:40] is Dental Leaders, the podcast where you get to go one on one [01:13:45] with emerging leaders in dentistry. Your [01:13:50] hosts Payman Langroudi and Prav Solanki.

Prav Solanki: Thanks [01:13:55] for listening guys. If you got this far, you must have listened to the whole thing. And [01:14:00] just a huge thank you both from me and pay for actually sticking through and listening to what we’ve had to [01:14:05] say and what our guest has had to say, because I’m assuming you got some value out of it.

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