Payman Langroudi: This podcast is brought to you by enlighten. Enlighten is an advanced teeth whitening system. Join [00:00:05] us for online training where I’ll take you through everything you need to know about how to [00:00:10] assess a case quickly, how to use the system, how to talk to patients. Because when [00:00:15] you know you can deliver brilliant results, it’s so much easier to talk about it. To book your course, which takes [00:00:20] only an hour. It’s completely free. Visit enlighten Online training.com. [00:00:25] Now let’s get to the pod.

[VOICE]: This [00:00:30] is Dental Leaders. The podcast [00:00:35] where you get to go one on one with emerging leaders in dentistry. Your [00:00:40] hosts, Payman Langroudi [00:00:45] and Prav Solanki.

Payman Langroudi: It gives me great pleasure to welcome Bashar Al-turk [00:00:50] to the podcast. This is a long time coming, dude. It’s been what? When was the first time [00:00:55] you contacted me? A good year and a half. Two years ago.

Bashar Alturk: I think so, yeah.

Payman Langroudi: You must have been a third year [00:01:00] dental student back then.

Bashar Alturk: That’s correct.

Payman Langroudi: But I was just qualified as a dentist. Fingers crossed. [00:01:05] Um, got your graduation coming up. And, uh, also [00:01:10] an Olympic hopeful at the very highest level of, uh, trampolining. Just missed [00:01:15] out on the last Olympics because of an injury and still training.

Bashar Alturk: That’s correct. [00:01:20] Thank you very much for the invitation. And thank you so much for the warm introduction. [00:01:25]

Payman Langroudi: My pleasure. So you’re at Leeds finishing off five years. Just [00:01:30] give me that feeling.

Bashar Alturk: Mixed emotions. I think [00:01:35] just I think I don’t look at it as five years. I think it’s [00:01:40] been the 20 ish years of education. Yeah. It’s it’s it really [00:01:45] is going to be a win for me and my family massively. Um, really excited. [00:01:50] Looking forward to the future. Sad. You know, it’s going to be the last [00:01:55] time. And I do appreciate with all of us together as a group, as friends. [00:02:00] The last time you can go out with your friends on a random day and enjoy yourself. [00:02:05] But I think ready to move on. Really looking forward to it.

Payman Langroudi: And what’s [00:02:10] your feelings about Leeds, the town you grew up in? Manchester.

Bashar Alturk: That’s [00:02:15] correct.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. These are good student town it is. But what? You know, just give me [00:02:20] some Leeds reflections.

Bashar Alturk: Smaller than Manchester. Yeah, I’ve really liked [00:02:25] it. Very similar.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: As a student city. Amazing. Whether it’s the nights [00:02:30] out or you’re only 25 minutes away from the countryside or you’re not too far away from the Peak District. [00:02:35] Um, I’ve loved it. Just middle sized city. [00:02:40] But the student life and the student connections been amazing. And [00:02:45] I’ll miss it.

Payman Langroudi: I thought I was in Cardiff and the size of city. I reckon Cardiff [00:02:50] and Leeds are similar. Um. It’s a, it’s a brilliant sized city. Yeah. Because I grew up [00:02:55] in London But the nice thing about those cities is they’re big enough that [00:03:00] if you want to see a live music performance, you can. Or you want [00:03:05] to go to watch an ice hockey game. There is. Yeah, but they’re small [00:03:10] enough that if you bump into someone for the first time, if you meet someone for the first time, you [00:03:15] know, at some point in the future, you’re going to bump into that person again. And that’s super interesting [00:03:20] for me because in London, it’s quite the opposite. You know, you will never see this person ever again. It puts a [00:03:25] different sort of slant on the relationship. Yeah. Does that resonate.

Bashar Alturk: Massively, [00:03:30] even to the point where you meeting people in Leeds and even, [00:03:35] let’s say for the second time, and you’ve seen the person before and you’re a bit like, yeah, I remember [00:03:40] you and was like, you know, coming to London today and it’s just a complete different world. [00:03:45] Yeah. But going back to Leeds, I quite like it. There’s, there’s more of a connection, [00:03:50] but also a pressure because I know, like you said, you will see this person again and this person will know this [00:03:55] person and who will also know this person.

Payman Langroudi: So it also means, you know, that people are nicer to each [00:04:00] other because of that. Yes. Yeah. Because if you think I’m never going to see this guy again and you’re [00:04:05] an idiot, you might, you know, whatever, not hold the door open for him, let’s say. Yeah. Yeah. But [00:04:10] whereas if everyone’s kind of connected, I remember in Cardiff, you’re standing in the queue in some shop trying to buy a bottle of [00:04:15] water, and everyone’s talking to each other in the queue. The Welsh are very special that way. [00:04:20] The Yorkshire people are too.

Bashar Alturk: I can imagine it’s very similar, I can imagine.

Payman Langroudi: Did you find the difference between Yorkshire [00:04:25] people and Manchester people? They are different.

Bashar Alturk: I think very similar. The [00:04:30] accents different.

Payman Langroudi: No, no, I know that.

Bashar Alturk: But I think personally [00:04:35] what I found up north are a lot more lovelier, if [00:04:40] that’s a word. Um. Chirpy. Um. Happy to smile in your face. Yeah. [00:04:45] Um, when I’ve walked past London today, everyone’s, you know, busy just like, like [00:04:50] a rat race, as they say quickly. So I’ve, I’ve quite enjoyed being up north. I think, [00:04:55] um, or living up north. Um, I think they’re very similar, um, kind, happy [00:05:00] to help, um, easygoing people I think.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. I find that Manchester [00:05:05] it’s got, it’s so kind of got everything. Yeah. That people kind of hold themselves a little bit, [00:05:10] you know, they, they, you know, they might be dressed in designer gear and this and that and [00:05:15] having Wagyu steak or whatever. Manchester’s got everything. Yeah. You know, so that attitude, for [00:05:20] instance, I find Liverpool people much easier to talk to. Like cold, cold [00:05:25] approach. Cold talk to someone you’ve [00:05:30] never met before. Yeah, a Liverpool person. I just find it easy. It’s like water. Yeah. [00:05:35] They’re just so cool and funny and friendly.

Bashar Alturk: Similar to the Irish, I find [00:05:40] very lovely people. Yes. Now you mention Manchester, [00:05:45] so I know old Manchester. I think Manchester itself is changing rapidly. [00:05:50] Um, and I think now I’m going into, you know, mid 20s when I [00:05:55] see that that sort of side of people, the, the nice designer gear, the dresses, and they’re going out to [00:06:00] fancy places. Whereas the people that I’ve met from Manchester through growing up slightly different. [00:06:05]

Payman Langroudi: Um, which part of Manchester did you grow up?

Bashar Alturk: So I grew up in North Manchester, which people [00:06:10] will say sometimes is the darker side of Manchester. Yeah. Um in a place called Prestwich. Um but [00:06:15] I’ve loved it um very close to town, very close to everything, whether it’s a gym, [00:06:20] um travel or takeaway, [00:06:25] you’ve, you’ve got it all in fact, um I was saying gymnastics, I lived [00:06:30] four minutes away from, from the gym. So that was beautiful. It was and that’s what got me into the sport [00:06:35] at first. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Let’s talk about that. How old were you when you first did gymnastics? [00:06:40]

Bashar Alturk: I think I was around two years old.

Payman Langroudi: Two.

Bashar Alturk: Two years old. So I’ve known my original [00:06:45] coach since I was two years old.

Payman Langroudi: Bloody hell.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Cool.

Bashar Alturk: Um, Santa [00:06:50] was close by. I think the original story was mum just wanted [00:06:55] us to get into as much sports, whether it was swimming, horse riding, um, [00:07:00] trampolining, whatever was close by and whatever we could do at the time when we’d put everything [00:07:05] into us.

Payman Langroudi: Pushy, pushy Arab mum.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. Pushy Arab mum.

Payman Langroudi: But.

Bashar Alturk: Purely for the [00:07:10] love of us, like.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, of.

Bashar Alturk: Course, you know, mum put us first financially, everything. [00:07:15] She just wanted us to have as many experiences. There’s four of us, including me. Oh, [00:07:20] really? Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Which number are you?

Bashar Alturk: I’m the second. So. Oldest boy. Um, older [00:07:25] sister. Me younger sister, who’s just below, like a year, I think. [00:07:30] And then a younger brother who’s quite considerably younger, about 14 now. Um, so [00:07:35] it’s a, it’s a nice dynamic. I’ve really enjoyed that. So mum. Yeah. She took us to the sport. [00:07:40]

Payman Langroudi: What kind of a house is it. Would you class it as, as a Jordanian house.

Bashar Alturk: I’d [00:07:45] like to say Jordanian, but I think the bigger word is chaotic. It’s [00:07:50] the most chaotic house. And since living back, living [00:07:55] at uni and walking in back at home, I say, mum, dad, I can’t do this.

Payman Langroudi: It’s [00:08:00] stuff happening all the time.

Bashar Alturk: Stuff happening and little [00:08:05] arguments. We all love each other. But yeah, I’d say very Jordanian. Um, a very [00:08:10] Jordanian household, I like that.

Payman Langroudi: So then, okay, two, two years old jumping [00:08:15] around in the gym. All right. Yeah. How did that become Olympics.

Bashar Alturk: So [00:08:20] yeah, just I think we’d all gone together. Me and my two older older sister, me and [00:08:25] my two sisters. And I’d gone in and just sort of played around. Um, [00:08:30] I think the coach really took a liking to me at this point. Um, if you get to know me, I’ll try everything. [00:08:35] I’ll do anything jump off, um, a really high cliff as long as it’s safe to, to a [00:08:40] degree, I’ll do it. I’ll have to skydive. I’d love to do what? What? Whatever is cool. I’ll go [00:08:45] for it. And I remember going back when I was about four years of age, 4 or [00:08:50] 5, and they were better than me. So the first competition that we ever did actually jump into that, both [00:08:55] of my sisters beat me considerably. So it was very interesting, but I stuck at [00:09:00] it and I loved it. And there were periods that we’d stopped. And I remember [00:09:05] being around 5 or 6 at the time, and we had a garden in the back, trampoline in the garden. [00:09:10] We had a trampoline in the garden, and I landed on my head. So this was [00:09:15] the start of my injury prone career.

Bashar Alturk: And I remember being rushed off to hospital. Um, [00:09:20] I think I’d only bruised my neck or something, but it was really like my mum was like, no, you [00:09:25] really enjoy this. Focus on it. Let’s take you into training again. Um, and [00:09:30] from then it just, it just flourished. Um, every Friday after [00:09:35] school we’d go to training and um, the coach spotted me, um and [00:09:40] from that regional national and really accelerated quite [00:09:45] quick, um, with anything that I do. I put a lot of effort into it and [00:09:50] I adore trampoline just stuck with me. Whether I was in school, I wouldn’t be thinking about, [00:09:55] um, what we were being taught. I’ve got like old sketchbooks [00:10:00] and I’ve just been drawing like trampolines and me on a podium with a Chinese and a Russian [00:10:05] guy, and I just adored it. I just YouTube was just trampoline and I [00:10:10] think it was from applying myself inadvertently. I didn’t know what I was [00:10:15] doing, but I was so engulfed in the world of trampoline. I just started to get better and better. Um, [00:10:20] and I really loved it. And then I got into the squads and, and [00:10:25] that was it.

Payman Langroudi: Do you consider yourself super competitive? Right. Must be.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, massively, majorly [00:10:30] competitive.

Payman Langroudi: And an adrenaline junkie.

Bashar Alturk: Massively as well.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. No, I [00:10:35] read a thing about adrenaline junkies here that, uh, like much like your first trampolining [00:10:40] was age two. Yeah, yeah. So, you know, in a way like your body shape [00:10:45] as it’s if you’re doing something as it’s forming that goes into your [00:10:50] sort of muscle memory, if you like. Yeah. And I’ve noticed, like, I don’t know, when [00:10:55] I was 27, someone told me, know when you ride a bike, the toe of your bike [00:11:00] needs to be on the pedal, not the, not the, the arch of your, your foot. Okay. So at 27, [00:11:05] I decided from now on, I’m going to just do that. I’m going to always have my toe on the front of [00:11:10] the thing. Yeah. And from 27 to 47, that’s how I rode. And it [00:11:15] never felt right. Yeah. No. Because from two till 27 I was doing it the other way. And [00:11:20] my muscles had moved, you know, in that direction. Yeah. So I know [00:11:25] physically jumping around at two, two years old, your body ends up forming. And [00:11:30] but I’m more interested in the mental side of it here. So you said to me before [00:11:35] you, you at school, you had short attention span and, and that sort of thing, ADHD [00:11:40] and naughty in class and all that. But [00:11:45] what would you say is the mental side of for you [00:11:50] of being an elite athlete?

Bashar Alturk: I [00:11:55] think it’s an adjunct. If anything, I think having [00:12:00] ADHD. Sport [00:12:05] gives me something. Um, focus, focus. It makes me focus not just in sport, [00:12:10] hyper fixated on the sport, but also outside. So we didn’t really know I had ADHD [00:12:15] until it was Covid time. Oh really? So it was in school and [00:12:20] I was very naughty in school.

Payman Langroudi: And you were in school during Covid?

Bashar Alturk: Um, well, I had to go back to school during Covid [00:12:25] because I found it so hard to stay at home.

Payman Langroudi: But you were a school kid at that point? [00:12:30]

Bashar Alturk: Yes. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: It makes me feel very old, man. Yeah. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: It’s such a [00:12:35] long time ago. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: It feels like day before yesterday. So [00:12:40] what were your A-levels at that point?

Bashar Alturk: Um GCSE first year of A-levels. Okay. [00:12:45] And it was a shock to the system. And it was it was really hard. And I’m not sure what [00:12:50] Covid was like for yourself, but.

Payman Langroudi: Scary.

Bashar Alturk: Scary, scary. Did you know you’ve [00:12:55] got I found you’ve got two sides of people, those who adored lockdown and.

Payman Langroudi: Oh [00:13:00] yeah, I adored the time. I adored the time. But you know, business is going to go under. Yeah. [00:13:05] You know, at that point we were over extended as well. We had like 40 people.

Bashar Alturk: Oh, [00:13:10] wow.

Payman Langroudi: And we were moving. We were putting a lab in and all this, you know, financially with business. You said you love [00:13:15] business. Yeah. With business, as you know, you’ve had a couple of businesses at least your own. As [00:13:20] you know, there are times where you risk the whole business at the beginning. Yeah. You risk the whole business [00:13:25] on one move. Yeah. Because it’s the beginning. You’ve got nothing. Yeah. Now obviously [00:13:30] it’s a different thing. Like I know some people do do that. Elon Musk. Elon Musk famously [00:13:35] risked Tesla and SpaceX at the [00:13:40] same time. Yeah. Um, anyway, but yeah, so we were overextended. So in business, [00:13:45] sometimes you do get overextended financially. Yeah. And then suddenly overnight. And so [00:13:50] I think at the time we were bringing in, it was like £18,000 a day was coming in [00:13:55] at the time. Right. Suddenly overnight zero. Yeah. And we were overextended. Yeah. [00:14:00] So 0000000. And then it was like, wait a [00:14:05] minute. What’s going to happen? How am I going to pay the team? Yeah. And then they announced the furlough [00:14:10] scheme over here. But loads of countries. There was no there was no furlough scheme. Yeah. Even in America, [00:14:15] some loads of businesses went under in that fear of that was like [00:14:20] a real. Imagine in your head was a massive. But every business owner went through it.

Bashar Alturk: I [00:14:25] can imagine how difficult that was.

Payman Langroudi: And so. So did you go see a doctor, [00:14:30] a psychologist, someone like how did you get this diagnosis that I am ADHD just.

Bashar Alturk: It was always [00:14:35] pushed during school, but I don’t know if it’s similar to Middle Eastern parents. Mum was like, no, he’s fine. [00:14:40] We’re going to work on it. He’s okay.

Payman Langroudi: We were talking about this last night. Yeah, my cousin’s [00:14:45] a psychiatrist. No, we were saying the Middle Eastern position on mental health is either crazy [00:14:50] or sane. Those are the only two positions.

Bashar Alturk: Exactly. [00:14:55] But I thought it was almost advantageous. Oh, yeah. Looking. [00:15:00] We’ve discussed it a lot in depth with my mum, but from primary school we’d [00:15:05] have an assessment, but it would always be stopped before we get the diagnosis. And my mum [00:15:10] didn’t believe in labelling. It’s a very, very dangerous territory because one [00:15:15] could argue a lot of help could have been given.

Payman Langroudi: Sorry. Bless you.

Bashar Alturk: But [00:15:20] one could argue that a lot of help could be given at the right time. But for me, I found [00:15:25] that not labelling myself, I had to apply myself in the same way I did with [00:15:30] sport. This is just me. I knew that I found it difficult to focus. So [00:15:35] I finished training around 9:00 and during GCSE period and go home and just revise, [00:15:40] and I’d be sat down at a desk for 4 or 5 hours, not really doing [00:15:45] anything, and then time would go and I knew there was something. So [00:15:50] yeah, going back to it, mum was just like, no, no, don’t want to get him to Labour. I just [00:15:55] had to work really hard, hit Covid and that was it. There was no sport, there was no [00:16:00] socialising with friends, everything got cut short and it was very clear [00:16:05] and it wasn’t. Adhd for me isn’t just focusing um on on [00:16:10] tasks or is it just focusing in school? It’s the wider picture, it’s relationships, [00:16:15] friendships, liaising with people, emotions as well. [00:16:20] Um, and we found it really hard during Covid. I just not sure what to do at the time.

Bashar Alturk: Um, [00:16:25] so we discussed it with school and we was getting to the point where I was going to sit my [00:16:30] exams and part of me thought this will get me some extra time during my, you know, applying for dental school. I’ll [00:16:35] take the help. And yeah, we saw a psychiatrist [00:16:40] and educational psychiatrist, one through the school and that was liaised with, um, and [00:16:45] diagnosed me. I scored incredibly high on the test. I remember, um, and [00:16:50] the difference is now sometimes if [00:16:55] I’m really struggling and I found that school incredibly hard, sometimes I, you know, I’ll be on the phone [00:17:00] to my mum and I’ll say, yeah, it’s, I’m finding it really difficult to focus now and I can almost [00:17:05] subconsciously blame. It was I think if I’d done that very [00:17:10] early on during my education career, maybe I’d be at a different point of view. So reflecting on it, [00:17:15] I think delaying the diagnosis has worked in my favour. [00:17:20] I wouldn’t advise it. I’m not sure what your other alternative was, [00:17:25] but it was very useful for me because I didn’t have anything to blame. [00:17:30] I just had to work hard. Just.

Payman Langroudi: I think this is a mindset in itself, isn’t it? Like [00:17:35] another person, a losing mindset, would blame it for not getting to the Olympics [00:17:40] or something. Yeah, yeah. It’s a mindset in itself to take something negative and turn it into positive. [00:17:45] Do you think that’s kind of you anyway?

Bashar Alturk: Massively. And it’s not always been me. There’s definitely [00:17:50] been times where I’ve really struggled, but I think say with whatever, whether it was the [00:17:55] businesses that we discussed or Dental school or sport, I’ve always found it sink [00:18:00] or swim. Loads of times people have told me, don’t do this or don’t try this [00:18:05] or just focus. Don’t be a jack of all trades. You need to be a master of one, which I can appreciate. [00:18:10] But no, I do it and sink or swim and just keep [00:18:15] trying. And if I fail, there’s a lot of stuff I’ll learn from. And there’s been loads of stuff like, [00:18:20] for example, I’m sure we’ll get on to it. The injuries for a good few months. I [00:18:25] definitely wasn’t the positive person. I wasn’t saying thank God. [00:18:30] I was saying quite the opposite, in fact. Um.

Payman Langroudi: Let’s go through [00:18:35] it. Let’s go through it because it’s very interesting. Uh, as a pro sports guy and injury is a [00:18:40] setback. Yeah. Yeah. Um, at the same time, I’d imagine to be [00:18:45] at the very top of anything, you’re going to have to injure yourself because you’re pushing and pushing and pushing [00:18:50] to yourself to a limit. Yeah. And in trampoline, I don’t know how it works. You’re on a quadruple. [00:18:55] Whatever. Yeah. The first time in your life you’ve never done it before. You’re going to hit your head or hit [00:19:00] your shoulder or whatever it is. Yeah. So there’s that. But the, the parallel [00:19:05] that I’d like to look at is, okay, let’s say dentistry and trampoline. [00:19:10] Yeah. You’ve got an injury in, in, in trampoline. That [00:19:15] equivalent of that in dentistry might be failing an exam or getting sued by a patient [00:19:20] or whatever it is. Um, the thing that I’m really interested in is when, [00:19:25] when that’s happened to me, bad things in dentistry. On top of [00:19:30] the bad thing that’s happened. You’ve got the identity crisis. Yeah. I was [00:19:35] nowhere near the best Olympian dentist in the world. But your identity [00:19:40] is whatever it is. Like it might have been. I’m the best cosmetic dentist in this practice. [00:19:45]

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, that’s my identity that I’ve given myself. Yeah. That I’m proud of. And I’m happy to walk around [00:19:50] with. Yeah. Then I get a complaint from a patient, and the complaint might be a complaint. Might be something [00:19:55] like, you tried to steal money from me. Let’s say something like that. It’s not something that really goes to your [00:20:00] ethics or to your intent rather than your skill even. Yeah. Or you didn’t have the skill to do. [00:20:05] Now, not only I’ve got an unhappy patient that I have to deal with, not [00:20:10] only I’ve got to deal with my career, just, you know, also my whole identity is the best cosmetic [00:20:15] dentist in this practice is now in question. So for you, you must you know, [00:20:20] in gymnastics, your identity is the best trampoline in Manchester. Yeah. That goes [00:20:25] then the best trampoline in the north, then the country, then the Europe. Then you’re [00:20:30] trying to say, I want to be the best champion in the world. Yeah. Tell me about that. Does it does it get to you as [00:20:35] when you injure yourself, when you get a set back? Massively identity wise, [00:20:40] you start questioning yourself massively.

Bashar Alturk: I think identity, [00:20:45] I sort of started, let’s say university and I was an athlete, wasn’t an athlete. I was a [00:20:50] student athlete. Yeah. Student being the first part of it, especially for the first few years of my degree. [00:20:55] And. I remember being three months into my first year, [00:21:00] and I’d completely ruptured all the ligaments in my knee and I was lost [00:21:05] for my whole first year of university, I found it really difficult because I wasn’t this trampoline [00:21:10] sports scholarship sort of athlete that I was at university. I [00:21:15] felt like nobody really very just.

Payman Langroudi: The [00:21:20] first time.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. The first that was the first major injury. When I was [00:21:25] younger, I’d snapped my tib fib, so I was in a wheelchair actually for about six months. Wow. [00:21:30] But whilst you’re young, I don’t think you really appreciate what’s [00:21:35] going on and I find it quite fun. I was in a cast and my friends were signing it, going around school in a wheelchair at [00:21:40] the time. It gave me a lot, a lot of appreciation for people who have to go through that every day. [00:21:45] Massively for my family as well during that period. Because just [00:21:50] on a side note, I guess when you’re injured, it’s not just you mentally as well. Who am I affecting [00:21:55] around me? But the physical side of who’s helping me? Who’s taking me to the bathroom? So [00:22:00] yeah, I got injured in first year and this was the first major injury. Whilst, you know, [00:22:05] I’ve just moved away from home, you know, new life, new school, university, [00:22:10] just just new routine. And it was cut short. I [00:22:15] didn’t know how to deal with myself and it was really hard. I [00:22:20] found it. The only rock I had at the time was my mum and. [00:22:25] And there’d be times at university that. Just not sure what to do with my day. My usual [00:22:30] day would be wake up at six, I’d go to the gym or do some sort of rehab like like prehab sort [00:22:35] of stuff. We’d have university nine till five, sometimes nine till two and straight to the gym. [00:22:40] I’ll drive. Last year my routine was. I’ll drive straight to Sheffield around. We train two till [00:22:45] four and I’d do some schoolwork in between. And I’ll go to the gym in the afternoon and I’ll drive back from Sheffield [00:22:50] around 10:00. Back to bed.

Payman Langroudi: Every day.

Bashar Alturk: Every day, not weekends. [00:22:55] So it was hard to have that ripped away from you. It [00:23:00] was I was not sure what breaking, devastating. I remember being told by the doctor [00:23:05] and I was really lucky at the time, a doctor called Doctor Barkat Ali, an amazing guy. [00:23:10] And I remember being told you’ve ruptured your knee and just [00:23:15] burst out into tears. And for us, we had an experience with another highly [00:23:20] talented athlete. He ruptured also his ligaments in his knee. I’m [00:23:25] not sure if his surgeries weren’t as advanced as they are at that time, but that was it for him and [00:23:30] he tried a lot, and that’s what I thought.

Payman Langroudi: So because he had no idea whether you’d get through it or not. [00:23:35] Right. Actually, when you’re in the moment might be career ending.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. And that’s what I [00:23:40] thought. And, and I almost swore the first time I ruptured my knee. I’m not touching a [00:23:45] trampoline again. That sort of it’s almost all or nothing. And it’s a lot with me in [00:23:50] a lot of stuff. I like to really apply myself. So when I can’t do it, I was like, we’re done. All [00:23:55] my hopes that we’re going are gone. Comes to the second time. Now we’re in [00:24:00] fourth year and I’ve got exams at this point and quite difficult exams. I’ve ruptured the right hand side. [00:24:05]

Payman Langroudi: Same thing on the other side.

Bashar Alturk: On the other side.

Payman Langroudi: Wow.

Bashar Alturk: Devastating. [00:24:10] A couple of weeks before final exams and fourth year. And I just got to the point where [00:24:15] I felt this is going really well. Now we’re looking to the future. We’re thinking about the next [00:24:20] Olympic cycle. You know, I was doing multiple triples in the routine and the coaches were really [00:24:25] happy. And I think I finally got over the left hand side, just chanced. [00:24:30] I hit just come to the side, hit like a metal pot on a trampoline. So trampoline [00:24:35] is such a fast sport. We have forces six times our [00:24:40] body weight, so that’s the weight that goes through us. More G force and astronaut on takeoff. So any [00:24:45] slight error mistake it’s gone. Um so again having [00:24:50] to pick myself back up during exam season. And the honest answer was I didn’t. [00:24:55] It was just having a really good people, good group of people around me, good friends, [00:25:00] good family, um, which made made the difference. And in time, [00:25:05] you know, we’re a year on from the injury now I’m starting, you know, time heals everything, [00:25:10] whether it’s it’s injuries or life in general. And um, I’ve [00:25:15] now started to train again and really not wanting to push forward. Um, even with [00:25:20] dentistry, um, it happens the same. I think there is a big loss of identity similar [00:25:25] to what you were saying about being a cosmetic dentist. Um, I like to do the best [00:25:30] and that comes from, you know, when I see a patient, especially at university, I found [00:25:35] that I, I over promise sometimes and as a student under deliver and [00:25:40] I found that really hard again and making those mistakes.

Payman Langroudi: Um, you’re listening [00:25:45] you’re going into feet next, right?

Bashar Alturk: That’s correct. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: It’s a big mistake of young dentists. [00:25:50] Yeah. That they think that being a dentist is [00:25:55] somewhere where you go, you get seen for 20 minutes or NHS even [00:26:00] less than that. And that you’re expected to give this authoritative answer on the [00:26:05] solution to that problem. Yeah. There and then. And it has to be right and everything. And [00:26:10] what young dentists end up doing is they overconfident? Yeah. Come [00:26:15] across as overconfident. Yeah, I can deal with this. I’m your dentist. I can handle it. They [00:26:20] can’t deal with it. Um, whereas if you think about it, dude, [00:26:25] you’ve been to, you know, top coaches or whatever. Yeah. If you ask your top coach a [00:26:30] question and he says, I don’t know, you kind of respect him a bit more. Yeah, yeah. [00:26:35] Because you know, he he knows what he doesn’t know is a big thing. [00:26:40] Yeah. So never worry about saying I don’t know. And I’m going to ask someone [00:26:45] that question. Yeah. I remember when I was your age, I had a mentor. And every time [00:26:50] I mention the mentor. So I’m going to ask my mentor. That would help. Yeah. With the patient. [00:26:55] Tell me about this. What’s the crux of trampoline? [00:27:00] So I’m guessing there’s some sort of you have to optimise [00:27:05] the bounce from that. What do you call the bit that bounces.

Bashar Alturk: The trampoline bed?

Payman Langroudi: The bed. You have [00:27:10] to you have to optimise that bounce. Yeah. And so so there’s that. Yeah. [00:27:15] Then then you have to. Up in the air. Was it like a visualisation [00:27:20] story? How do you know? Like what’s the difference between a great trampolinist and a good [00:27:25] trampolinist in that sense?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. So so what? We’re judged off. Yeah. [00:27:30] We’re judged. So trampoline and judged off execution. How neat the elements are [00:27:35] similar to gymnastics and other sports. How difficult the elements are. So the more twists, [00:27:40] there’s more somersaults. Um, and also how high. Um, so there’s a [00:27:45] laser underneath the trampoline that measures how high you can go and the time spent in the air. And [00:27:50] the last one is just keeping it very central, but you.

Payman Langroudi: Have to be very stiff to get the maximum. And then you have to be very supple [00:27:55] to. It’s weird. It’s a really weird, weird.

Bashar Alturk: Athlete profile because [00:28:00] you have to be so fast, but also so powerful and strong, which sometimes [00:28:05] don’t go in. So some of the the Chinese and the Russians that I’ve competed against, they [00:28:10] are, you know, 55 kilos, 58 kilos, whereas I’m more [00:28:15] 82, 83. And so that’s been really hard itself in trampolining. [00:28:20] It’s it’s it’s what makes a good athlete. It’s, it’s the mentality. It’s the honest answer. It’s [00:28:25] the hard work. It’s being able to be injured or, you know, not [00:28:30] do a skill properly and get back up and do it again. It’s the fearlessness, you know, as [00:28:35] kids learning skills. We mentioned it before. We you have [00:28:40] to try skill. You build it up in increments and, and, and it’s what I take from trampolining into dentistry. [00:28:45] And in any life you build, you build a skill, you do one somersault. Okay, now you can [00:28:50] try one and a half, well, one and three quarters and now you can try two. But there’s [00:28:55] times in trampoline where you’ll just lose yourself and you don’t have the vision points. [00:29:00] So if I was to answer your question, build a perfect trampolinist someone who’s really strong, powerful, [00:29:05] very light, but also has a spatial awareness. And I think [00:29:10] that’s think sometimes something that’s gifted rather than worked for. [00:29:15] Um, and you find it funny. I’m actually on the other side [00:29:20] very not spatially aware at all. Really. Yeah. So a lot of the injuries, [00:29:25] actually one of them is I’ve just lost my self up there and you just spin, spin, [00:29:30] spin, spin until you hit the floor at the trampoline bed and you either hit the floor, the trampoline bed, you [00:29:35] don’t know where. Whereas some of my, um, some of the athletes I, um, I train with, they know [00:29:40] exactly where they are in the air and it’s just practice.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, yeah. And then mentality [00:29:45] wise. So you said, okay, you get the Chinese 55 kilos and you 82 kilos. Are [00:29:50] there different mentalities that succeed like I think of it in business, right? This, [00:29:55] this, there’s some business people they want, they want the minimum input for the maximum [00:30:00] output. Yeah. And they see the world like that. Yeah. Those are the opportunities they [00:30:05] chase. Yeah. Otherwise you just sit on Dragons Den, right. You’ve got the four. The four of them. And each [00:30:10] of them goes for something and doesn’t go for something different. Are there different mentalities [00:30:15] that end up being this sort of really good at getting up and dusting yourself [00:30:20] off? Yeah. Are they?

Bashar Alturk: I think so. I mean, with anything, it’s it’s you’ve always [00:30:25] got the really talented person who somewhat works hard.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Guided. [00:30:30] And you have the person who’s has a small amount of talent. You have to have a little bit more talent [00:30:35] I reckon in whatever. And who works really hard. Yeah. There’s there’s those [00:30:40] who work differently. So I think I work very different to [00:30:45] um, the next gymnastics. I like to turn up [00:30:50] on time, but not early for training, which is odd. I like to the [00:30:55] session to be running. I’ll come in, I’ll warm up really quickly and then I’ll work hard. Whereas [00:31:00] if there’s I know some athletes that will roll around for an hour before they get onto [00:31:05] the trampoline, and they like to prepare themselves in that way.

Payman Langroudi: What about on competition [00:31:10] day? How do you keep nerves away? How do you make sure your performance is the best [00:31:15] it’s going to be? I mean, there’s lots of parallels to that, right? I’m going to have to stand up on the stage of [00:31:20] Ministry of Sound and deliver this event. Yeah, I’m going to have some butterflies in my [00:31:25] tummy at that point. Do you do you have strategies for that or is it that you’ve done it so many times? It [00:31:30] becomes a second nature now.

Bashar Alturk: It’s a mixture. And it’s also, I’d [00:31:35] say just the pure thrill, adrenaline and enjoyment excitement. Absolutely. [00:31:40] So quite, you know, on the contrary, [00:31:45] a small competition, which is, you know, a regional national level that, you know, not many spectators. [00:31:50] I’ll get more nervous of there than when we were at the [00:31:55] Asian Games with 32,000 people packed out arena watching cameras [00:32:00] everywhere. So in a normal competition day, you know, I listen to music. Visualise [00:32:05] mirror the routine. I’m going to do it. I’m going to do it. And it’s just a positive self-talk. [00:32:10] Um, on the competition floor, when there’s cameras around you, I thrive. [00:32:15] I love it and I’m almost exhibitionist. Yeah, massively. If [00:32:20] you know, if, if you speak to any of the friends at uni.

Payman Langroudi: Oh really?

Bashar Alturk: That I love [00:32:25] to be, I love to be in the limelight. I’ll enjoy it. And it’s the same with dentistry, like a little bit like [00:32:30] we’ve done BDS a or um, been president at dent SoC last year. Speaking of [00:32:35] stage, I don’t mind it. I do get very nervous though, and it’s just just giving it a [00:32:40] go. And I think my peers would find very odd [00:32:45] that yeah, I do get very nervous. So in a competition competition day, it’s just distraction. [00:32:50] I distract myself with the cameras, wave at them, kiss the badge, um, [00:32:55] and then just visualise a routine and listen to music.

Payman Langroudi: What would you say is the sort [00:33:00] of the biggest downside of being this elite athlete. There [00:33:05] must be the sacrifice, right?

Bashar Alturk: Massively, I [00:33:10] think. I, I don’t believe I had really any proper friendships until Covid [00:33:15] time because my life was trampolining and and we’ve [00:33:20] not mentioned I used to do swimming as well. So I used to have to, you know, from the year [00:33:25] five, if I remember 5 a.m. starts, I’d go swimming before school [00:33:30] at train, go to school, love school, come home, go [00:33:35] to training and then and that’s it. So I think it’s the sacrifice. Sacrifice with time. [00:33:40] You know, from the age of 12, I didn’t go on a family holiday. So [00:33:45] every year we’d go to Jordan and go back home. But because I’d be [00:33:50] major competitions coming up in September, I wouldn’t go away with my family. And that’s really [00:33:55] hard. I found for for a youngster, you know, at the age of 12, just [00:34:00] seeing everyone go away and me and my dad staying behind just just to train. And I think that’s [00:34:05] been the hardest bit about being injured because you expect hard work [00:34:10] to equal success. And it doesn’t it doesn’t.

Payman Langroudi: Dentistry.

Bashar Alturk: Okay.

Payman Langroudi: That’s [00:34:15] the interesting difference. I had a guy, uh, Mike grey I don’t know if you heard his pod. He’s like [00:34:20] number 42. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: And the bikes.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Bicycle in the world. Yeah. And he was saying number 42 [00:34:25] in the world just doesn’t get you anywhere. Like financially, it’s like you basically pays for your flights. [00:34:30] Yeah. Um, but he was saying in dentistry, the more effort you put in, [00:34:35] the more you get out of it. Yeah. Whereas in, in bicycle he said somewhat, but it was more a mental [00:34:40] game. Okay. Yeah. Uh, he was also a musician. Yeah. And he was singing. Music has [00:34:45] nothing to do with the amount of effort. I mean, of course there’s effort, but, you know, it’s who you know and, and you know what [00:34:50] trends and you can put loads of effort in and not get out. Yeah. Like you’re saying. Yeah. [00:34:55] Um, I also remember Annie Seaborne. Do you know her?

Bashar Alturk: Yes. [00:35:00]

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. Um sports dentists as well.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. So she was doing lacrosse for [00:35:05] Wales. Yeah. And then had an injury at the same time as finals, uh [00:35:10] dentistry finals. And she said to me, I didn’t give a damn if I didn’t become a dentist. [00:35:15] That injury that didn’t take me to the Olympics was much, much bigger for me than, you know, she was that obsessed [00:35:20] by it. But then that’s what happened. Yeah. And do you know Robbie Hughes? [00:35:25] No.

Bashar Alturk: No. Oh no. Oh no. Oh yes. Yes. Liverpool. [00:35:30] Yeah. Of course. Yes.

Payman Langroudi: So he was a pro kickboxer.

Bashar Alturk: I didn’t know that for years. [00:35:35]

Payman Langroudi: Years and years and years. Wow. Um again travelled all over the world and he [00:35:40] was talking about the reason why he’s doing what he’s doing now, which is you can see [00:35:45] he’s very busy with avant garde dentistry and all that is he’s got this thing drilled [00:35:50] into him from childhood that you’ve got to live up to your potential, which is a very interesting [00:35:55] way of looking at something, you know, why would you work so hard at a business. Is it [00:36:00] the you know, is it is it the Rolex you’re trying to buy or whatever? You’ll soon find out once you’ve got that Rolex [00:36:05] is a total waste of time. Yeah. Like honestly, like even [00:36:10] I’ve got a friend who just bought himself Pagani. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Okay.

Payman Langroudi: And he said after about three weeks [00:36:15] he’s bought of of that.

Bashar Alturk: It wears off.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Yeah. The stuff doesn’t do it. [00:36:20] Then you say okay, experiences, you know, then there’s this other piece that’s like [00:36:25] a little like almost like a missing part of you that you’re trying to fill.

Bashar Alturk: Which [00:36:30] is no way.

Payman Langroudi: That you’re trying to fill you. And whether you call that your [00:36:35] ambition, your living up to your potential. Like maybe when you were a kid, [00:36:40] someone said, you’ll never be. That’s that little bit sometimes. Yeah. Even someone like someone [00:36:45] who adores you, like your mother could have said something to you that can that can create this little void. [00:36:50] You know, you don’t do it on purpose. Sometimes. Often by mistake. Yeah. Um, so [00:36:55] okay. You’re now going to do dentistry and [00:37:00] you’re right at the beginning. Do you remember? Did you do you sort of think, oh, I’m not [00:37:05] very good at this yet? You’re not whatever you want to think. You’re not very. Yeah. And do you remember what it was [00:37:10] like to be not very good at trampolining? And you’re kind of mirroring. You’re thinking I will be the best in the world. [00:37:15] Are you? What? Do you want to be a dentist? Do you want to be Olympic level?

Bashar Alturk: Yes. Do you? Yeah, absolutely. [00:37:20] You know, I love the business side of dentistry and I’m very interested in that side. Yeah. [00:37:25] But I really love the clinical side. And I know my experience is university [00:37:30] level. I’m very appreciative. I can turn around and we have I have two tutors. We see four patients [00:37:35] a day. I know it’s going to be very different next year, but I absolutely [00:37:40] adore it. And I think it’s I think it’s just the same as sport. You like you said, the harder [00:37:45] you work, the better you get at it. There’s so many avenues you can take. Yeah, you can beat this person. You need [00:37:50] to be better. You’re always evolving. You’re always learning. Um.

Payman Langroudi: But I don’t want to be. I [00:37:55] don’t want to be the fly in your ointment or the saliva on your etched enamel or whatever. Yeah, but. [00:38:00]

Bashar Alturk: Neither.

Payman Langroudi: But but but and I understand [00:38:05] why, you know, you got to this stage in, in gymnastics by being this. [00:38:10] So now, you know, it comes naturally to do the same thing in dentistry. But the [00:38:15] fact you told me that you didn’t have any real friendships by being that obsessive [00:38:20] cat, do you not think maybe there’s, there’s an idea that you don’t need to be an Olympic dentist? You can be, [00:38:25] you know, county level dentist. Yeah. And by the way, you don’t need [00:38:30] to be number three in the world in dentistry, if you were number 37 in the [00:38:35] UK, you’re amazing. You’re on fire. Yeah, yeah. So do [00:38:40] you not think maybe there’s an evolutionary like if you look back and say, okay, I had all these injuries. No [00:38:45] friends. Yeah, okay. I got to this level and I loved it. Yeah, yeah. Do you think [00:38:50] maybe in dentistry don’t follow that same playbook.

Bashar Alturk: I think I’ve learned a lot. [00:38:55] I think so. Um, I think one take thing I take from it from the [00:39:00] sport and.

Payman Langroudi: Take.

Bashar Alturk: The best bits, take the best bits, but also just to work hard. But [00:39:05] I do see what you’re saying in, in the fact that there is more to [00:39:10] life than just working hard away. And [00:39:15] I think I’ve tried to implement it. Implement that. I’m a big believer that everything happens [00:39:20] for a reason. So for example, when I got injured, I, I was like, [00:39:25] well, what do I do now? And I think the, the core group of friends I have at uni now, and [00:39:30] I think knowing everyone on, you know, a big thing I pride myself is just knowing everyone [00:39:35] on the course. It’s a small course, just making a connection with everyone. I don’t think I would have been able [00:39:40] to do that if I was training full time. So answering the question, [00:39:45] I think. So I think there’s a lot of lessons I’ve learned at uni that I’d want to [00:39:50] take them back with me and being the best I can be, but also not [00:39:55] forgetting what life’s about. And I have two very, very [00:40:00] successful uncles. However, they’re not married and that’s a big [00:40:05] thing of mine. And so going on to what.

Payman Langroudi: Was a big thing of.

Bashar Alturk: Yours, as in, you can be as successful [00:40:10] as you want. I’m very aware you can have the nice Rolex, you can have the amazing Ferrari. But [00:40:15] for me, real success genuinely is having that nice [00:40:20] like a cool family. And I think you can work as hard as you want for [00:40:25] success. And I hope this doesn’t come across in the wrong way. And I really [00:40:30] believe one day I will be successful. But I think and.

Payman Langroudi: And that’s called ambition, [00:40:35] right?

Bashar Alturk: Thank you. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: But but do you see the fact that they’re not married as failure. Yeah. [00:40:40] And that’s maybe that’s their choice or is it not their choice.

Bashar Alturk: I’m not sure. [00:40:45] Um again I think it is their choice. It is their choice I think. So I think, I think Yeah, [00:40:50] in a sense, but it’s just not the life I want to live. But then I’m not sure. Can [00:40:55] you work hard for that side of life? Can you can put yourself out [00:41:00] there. But I think true success, and it is very cliche is genuinely just having that family [00:41:05] and having, you know.

Payman Langroudi: But listen, let’s imagine you let’s say you do run the same playbook, [00:41:10] okay, in dentistry as you ran in gymnastics, now you’ve got a wife and two kids. Yeah. [00:41:15] And you’re completely ignoring them. You’re not, you’re not with them at the weekends. Yeah. Because you’re obsessed. [00:41:20] Yeah. One weekend you’re off at Frank spear. And, you know, in America next weekend [00:41:25] you’ve come to Ministry of Sound next next weekend, you know, you know what I mean? Yeah. Enlightened. It’s very [00:41:30] at the beginning, very easy to to lose your family. I wasn’t with my [00:41:35] kids much at all. Yeah. In the first ten years of, of, of enlighten, um, [00:41:40] sometimes there’s like a, I’ll do this now so that later I can [00:41:45] take my kids to the moon. Sometimes there’s that move. Yeah, yeah, I get that. Yeah. [00:41:50] But when you you said a couple of things that interest me. Number one, you said I think everything happens [00:41:55] for a reason why. I mean, it plays to that question. [00:42:00] If you take your lemons and turn them into lemonade.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: But is it just a belief? [00:42:05] Is it like the best way to live your life? Why does everything happen for a reason? In the past you’ve noticed [00:42:10] it.

Bashar Alturk: I think I’ve noticed it in the past. It’s a belief that’s instilled [00:42:15] in us, in religion, but with anything religion. Personally, for myself, it’s [00:42:20] what do I take from and what do I learn from it? Um, and I’ve found [00:42:25] that, for example, when I injured my first knee, I was down [00:42:30] for a good amount of time. Or what I believe to be is down and I couldn’t [00:42:35] see a reason why. But the. And I hated it and I was angry at the world. [00:42:40] I was angry at everything.

Payman Langroudi: Why did this happen to me?

Bashar Alturk: Why does this happen to me? There’s [00:42:45] no one looking out for me, it’s it’s everything bad happens to me all the time.

Payman Langroudi: Did you think [00:42:50] there was a God looking out for you? Yes, [00:42:55] grandma or something. It’s like some people think that way. Um.

Bashar Alturk: I [00:43:00] believe you make your own luck. So I think it [00:43:05] looking out for me. Yes, but I don’t think I really [00:43:10] understood the what that meant. But [00:43:15] until only until recently, if you asked me the honest answer, I probably still don’t understand [00:43:20] it completely. But you know, if I wasn’t in, if I didn’t get injured, [00:43:25] I wouldn’t have. I don’t think I would have focussed as much into my dentistry at the time. I don’t wouldn’t have met the friends. I wouldn’t have [00:43:30] gone out with people.

Payman Langroudi: Give me this, give me this. Yeah, it’s a, it’s a bit it’s a bit deep. [00:43:35] There’s, there’s, you’ve, you said you had some Palestinian ancestry, your [00:43:40] parents even. Right. Yeah. Um, there’s a kid bomb dropped on his head today And [00:43:45] he’s three years. Three days old. Was there a God looking out for him for that kid? Like, what was God doing in that [00:43:50] moment? Was it was it something like showing you to, you know, that kid didn’t have [00:43:55] what you’ve got, so you go get it. Kind of. Was that the move? If [00:44:00] it is that.

Bashar Alturk: From my perspective.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: I think it’s very hard. It’s very [00:44:05] hard. You know, a child dying or anything bad happening in someone’s life, the belief [00:44:10] is or belief that’s instilled in us that the good will come [00:44:15] from that in a point of view that because you’ve witnessed that, or [00:44:20] for that parent who’s, you know, who’s lost their child, there’ll be a place in heaven for them. There’s [00:44:25] always a reason to that happening from, from, [00:44:30] you know, I think whether you’re religious or not, it’s, it’s a journey and it’s a journey [00:44:35] of belief, man. That’s hard. And even as a, as a religious person, I can sit here and [00:44:40] say, if that happened to me.

Payman Langroudi: I get it. You could say to me, listen, don’t even be so presumptuous [00:44:45] to understand what God is thinking.

Payman Langroudi: No no no no no no no.

Payman Langroudi: It’s real. Right? If God is this, you know, completely [00:44:50] all powerful thing. But who am I to ask? I get that right. I get that. Um, [00:44:55] that that that’s certainly one thing. And you could say, oh, that child’s going straight to heaven type [00:45:00] stuff. Yeah, I get that. Um, what is your faith [00:45:05] being most tested? Was it during the NE period?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, I’d say so. [00:45:10] Definitely during the NE period to be honest. Anything [00:45:15] that’s, you know, been in my world severely bad. Um, yeah. [00:45:20] Especially during the period I was just didn’t understand why. [00:45:25] And I don’t think and at times I would blame life. [00:45:30] Sometimes God and I speak with my parents and I’d look deeper into [00:45:35] it. And it’s a journey in that sense. And I think [00:45:40] none of us can really understand why. And I say the why, even just the beauty [00:45:45] that I got to make friends. I don’t need to find a really deep, meaningful. But that was [00:45:50] also because I’ve recovered from it and there was good that came out from it, for [00:45:55] that child, for that mother or father who lost their child, maybe I’d be saying [00:46:00] something different. And that’s the honest answer, is that I don’t know this.

Payman Langroudi: I don’t know as beautiful [00:46:05] in situations where you can’t prove it. Yeah, that’s and faith is like that. Yeah, yeah. [00:46:10] You don’t even need to say anything else other than you don’t know. Yeah. You know, it’s [00:46:15] your intent. That’s the most important thing. If your intent is pure, you’re [00:46:20] trying to be a good person. That’s the key point. Yeah. Let’s talk [00:46:25] about you. Tell me you have a phantom head in your student room. Go [00:46:30] on. That’s the first time I’ve heard that. Where who came up with that idea? Was that you? [00:46:35] Yeah. Does anyone else have a phantom head? Does anyone else I should ask the audience.

Bashar Alturk: Not [00:46:40] that I know of at the moment. Um, it’s such.

Payman Langroudi: A cool idea. And [00:46:45] a drill. An electric drill.

Bashar Alturk: Everything. So so Micromotor electric [00:46:50] handpiece. Um, multiple like models. Phantom head pieces. [00:46:55] Composite.

Payman Langroudi: Brilliant idea man. Everything I’m gonna tell my daughter wants to be [00:47:00] a dentist now. Yeah. So I’m gonna tell her that’s what she has to do.

Bashar Alturk: I’ll show you where we got it from.

Payman Langroudi: That one. Well. [00:47:05]

Bashar Alturk: Actually, I know, on the contrary, a lot of it’s from China.

Payman Langroudi: Oh, [00:47:10] yeah. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: And and it would be a, uh, a physical model from China. [00:47:15] So all Nissan model from China.

Payman Langroudi: So go on, go on, go on. What what point in the Dental course did you [00:47:20] get a phantom head into your room?

Bashar Alturk: It was midway through third year or start of third year. We started to [00:47:25] see patients. And again with the trampoline. I want to practice more. But school, you can’t [00:47:30] go practice more. And I remember I went on to the clinics. I grabbed myself a phantom head. I [00:47:35] tried to practice. I got into trouble. Obviously not supervised. Um, they [00:47:40] weren’t, they weren’t happy. But I got a slap on the wrist and just said, you can’t do that. [00:47:45] I think in school they’re big on making it an equal playing field. If I’m [00:47:50] going to get five hours of practice time, he also has to get five hours in heel. So I wanted to take matters [00:47:55] into my own hand. So I researched how much then Phantom Head Unit was originally, [00:48:00] and then they can go for thousands. So back to the drawing board. Um, [00:48:05] and I looked online at, you know, like warehouses, China and I thought, okay, [00:48:10] and I just found it all there. And I got myself into a loophole of buying [00:48:15] everything and everything from like at the time, sexual [00:48:20] matrices. And I didn’t know what sexual matrix was. So but having it there made me [00:48:25] learn. Um, so yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Is this how you got into the loops business as well? Yeah. [00:48:30] So you started a loops company.

Bashar Alturk: That’s correct.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Were you inspired by Bryant?

Bashar Alturk: Massively.

Payman Langroudi: We’ve [00:48:35] just had them on the pod actually. No way. Yeah. So that’s coming out. So go on. So. So suddenly you’re [00:48:40] looking at China, you’re finding all this cheap dental stuff and you’re thinking I’m going to start a company. [00:48:45]

Bashar Alturk: Exactly.

Payman Langroudi: And how far did you get with that?

Bashar Alturk: We did really well, [00:48:50] to be fair. At the time I think we sold.

Payman Langroudi: The.

Bashar Alturk: Two. I’d like to say it was me and [00:48:55] two other friends at the time. So, um, a boy that I lived with, um and another boy who did, [00:49:00] um and um he did law and good friends of mine and [00:49:05] I knew I was going to fourth year of dental school. I was the president of the society at the time. I [00:49:10] was doing the BDS, I was doing sport. I was like, I like the idea, but I’m not [00:49:15] going to be able to execute it alone. And I think with everything in sport, it’s it’s having a good team. And [00:49:20] I saw the way that some of the other companies had set up. So I know Brian was set [00:49:25] up by student by Connor Bryant at the time. Um, not the time by Connor Bryant who set up set it [00:49:30] up when he was a student at the time, and other companies also. Um. Well, [00:49:35] why can’t we set up some sort of research where some companies [00:49:40] buy their, um their loops from or um and where they’re [00:49:45] getting the materials. Um and yeah, I’ve searched them and found China.

Payman Langroudi: Um [00:49:50] and did you, did you have this thing that was your, what was the positioning of your loop compared [00:49:55] to other loops?

Bashar Alturk: Student student price. We were.

Payman Langroudi: Price.

Bashar Alturk: Price [00:50:00] point. That was our USP. We sold five x refractive loops. And the idea is [00:50:05] hopefully to continue that on. It was called Dental Optics Co, and it was to provide [00:50:10] a price point where students could afford loops. Massive believer in loops. Again [00:50:15] it’s it’s with that sport just wanting the best of the best. Yeah. I think it’s impossible. [00:50:20]

Payman Langroudi: Did you do research. Sorry. What is the current cheapest loop on the market.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. So I mean originally.

Payman Langroudi: You undercut that [00:50:25] guy.

Bashar Alturk: Um yeah. Massively.

Payman Langroudi: Um but then didn’t you think that the next guy will come and undercut [00:50:30] me. No it wasn’t just didn’t run through time.

Bashar Alturk: So hours were self adjustable, [00:50:35] so we weren’t making them through the loop through the lens. So there wasn’t a manufacturing process tailored to the [00:50:40] student. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: Um, so take me through your thinking. Were you at every point being super like [00:50:45] frugal to make sure that this is the cheapest way that anyone in their right mind would try and sell [00:50:50] it? Yeah. Like it’s kind of the prem way, you know, the boutique way. Yeah. Yeah. The [00:50:55] price he’s selling it at is difficult to sell less than that price. Yes. His his [00:51:00] product. Yeah. I mean, but lots of people have.

Bashar Alturk: Okay.

Payman Langroudi: Lots of people have. And [00:51:05] the important thing to understand is price can’t be the only thing factor. [00:51:10] Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: And I learned a lot. It was a lesson that was learned. And I think with loops, [00:51:15] that comes not just the sale of the loops, but the aftercare. And it’s something I learned after. [00:51:20] Yes, I might be selling loop for X amount. Yes.

Payman Langroudi: How much are you selling them for?

Bashar Alturk: Um, £350 [00:51:25] at a time.

Payman Langroudi: How much are you buying them for?

Bashar Alturk: Um a hundred. Um [00:51:30] about a 100 and bulk sale in the end.

Payman Langroudi: Landed.

Bashar Alturk: Landed.

Payman Langroudi: 100. [00:51:35] Landed. Yeah. And you were saying for 350.

Bashar Alturk: And at the time. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: It’s not bad.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. And it was, there [00:51:40] was there was.

Payman Langroudi: Not so many of them to make any money.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. We, we, we didn’t at the time. We, [00:51:45] we sold loads.

Payman Langroudi: Who was your first customer people in your year.

Bashar Alturk: No, actually it was through [00:51:50] Shopify. Shopify online. We were selling to.

Payman Langroudi: The.

Bashar Alturk: Area. We were selling a website [00:51:55] and they were selling it to around. So it was um Bulgaria. Um, at [00:52:00] first.

Payman Langroudi: Um, and what about stuff like the person buying it from your website? Yeah. [00:52:05] Did you have your own brand name on it or did you.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. So we [00:52:10] had our.

Payman Langroudi: Own Dental optics.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. These were the loops that I was using in clinics. So I believed in [00:52:15] them. So I, the whole original story happened was I wanted a pair of loops. I couldn’t afford a pair of loops [00:52:20] at the time.

Payman Langroudi: Alibaba.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, exactly. I tried to find a solution that was purely. [00:52:25] We bought the loops. At first. A lot of students buy. I thought, well, oh no, I want refractive loops. [00:52:30] But at the time I didn’t want to spend the money on refractive loops. So research for myself. I [00:52:35] used them for a year, loved them. And I thought, well, if I’m using them, why can’t everyone else use.

Payman Langroudi: The refractive [00:52:40] as well?

Bashar Alturk: They were refractive and that was the whole point. So I was using them and I loved them. So I thought, [00:52:45] let’s start. Yeah. And so we sold online. They would get the whole branding. [00:52:50] It was it was branded in a box with the logo name. They could get their name customised on it. [00:52:55] Um, it was on loops, the branding, and then it’d be a video and we had the returns process [00:53:00] and period. There was a video that would teach them how to adjust the loops if they had.

Payman Langroudi: You made.

Bashar Alturk: That [00:53:05] we made and if they needed any help, um, then they would contact us with the other students. [00:53:10] Not not so much. And then when we start to sell, we sold a few in our year. Um, [00:53:15] and it was through that that was hard. I mean, that was another lesson I looked, I learned [00:53:20] from the loops was not just the aftercare, but within dentistry, working [00:53:25] with friends and selling to friends.

Payman Langroudi: I still find that hard.

Bashar Alturk: Difficult and [00:53:30] even a lesson I’ve learned. Treatment. On on on a on on a family [00:53:35] friend or someone you know. It’s hard.

Payman Langroudi: It’s hard. Yeah. Definitely harder than a real patient.

Bashar Alturk: Massively. [00:53:40] And it’s throughout that.

Payman Langroudi: I guess just to give me an example, give [00:53:45] me an example. You sold one to someone in your year. Yeah. He wasn’t 100% happy. It kind of affected the [00:53:50] friendship kind of thing.

Bashar Alturk: No, to be honest with with the boy, at first it was perfect. Um, [00:53:55] and yeah, it was fine. It’s the unease of it, though. [00:54:00] Yeah. It’s it’s the most transactional. The pressure on me, I felt to [00:54:05] make sure they were good. I text him like every two weeks, like, how are you getting on [00:54:10] with him? Are you okay with them? How are they doing? And I think for first, like 150 [00:54:15] days, I was very nervous just. And it’s the same. I’ve [00:54:20] done loads of stuff. I used to sell cars, um, during university. Really? Yeah. So I’d [00:54:25] buy cars on line and I’d get them fixed up and I’d send them on for a profit. And [00:54:30] I remember I sold one of my friends an Audi A3 at the time, um, [00:54:35] at the time his father had passed away and he got a lump sum of money and he wants to buy a car. So [00:54:40] we sold him a car almost two years. I was nervous every time [00:54:45] like the MOT would go through because electronics are cars, a car, customers [00:54:50] are customers. The issues are going to arise. It’s making sure it doesn’t [00:54:55] affect the friendship and it’s definitely lessons learned. I try to avoid it. Um, the car [00:55:00] was perfect, thank God, but I didn’t know that I did did my best to make sure it was good, but anything [00:55:05] can break at any point.

Payman Langroudi: And it also it goes to your mindset around sort of complaints [00:55:10] if you like, like, for instance, in our business, you know, the toothpaste part of our [00:55:15] business, there’s no way you can sell thousands, hundreds of thousands of [00:55:20] tubes of toothpaste without someone. Or Let’s [00:55:25] say you sell 100,000 tubes and a hundred people complain. Yeah, [00:55:30] that’s 1 in 1000 people complaining. Yeah. It’s nothing. It’s irrelevant. Yeah. [00:55:35] But in our other business, the the Dental business that we’re selling to [00:55:40] dentists, one complaint ruins our day completely ruins everyone’s day. Enlightened. And [00:55:45] and people, we’ve changed whole processes because of one complaint all [00:55:50] the time for the last 25 years. It’s like it’s one of our superpowers that we keep on getting better and [00:55:55] better and better. But if if your mindset in the toothpaste business is [00:56:00] that one complaint is going to break your heart, you’re not going to you’re not going to do that business because you know, it’s [00:56:05] that’s the way it goes. Yeah. Yeah. And then some people will take that to another extreme, you [00:56:10] know, they’ll say total crap. Yeah. Total crap. Yeah. You know what it’s like online? [00:56:15] Shopify, right? You make a promise, a photo of something that you’re not even going to send them. [00:56:20] Don’t deliver it and they don’t care. Yeah. So yeah, it depends on what your mindset is. Um, [00:56:25] and it sounds like you really want to do well for people that you sell something to.

Bashar Alturk: Yes. [00:56:30]

Payman Langroudi: Indeed.

Bashar Alturk: And I found that being really hard.

Payman Langroudi: How do you feel about delegation? [00:56:35] Because sometimes that control freak nature [00:56:40] means you can’t delegate. Have you ever had to delegate? You must have been a. [00:56:45] Yeah, you were delegating all the time, right?

Bashar Alturk: Pdsa conference Dental the [00:56:50] Dental Society.

Payman Langroudi: What have you learned about delegation?

Bashar Alturk: Massive. Massive. Massive [00:56:55] amount. I’d say at first being dance president or even with PDSA, I was [00:57:00] very nice to people and that was hard. I think there’s a line that has to be [00:57:05] drawn where something has to be done. So for example, I think [00:57:10] dental societies, especially the way the way they’re run now, or even PDSA, they turn out the turnovers, [00:57:15] ridiculous of of money coming in from sponsors. It’s a [00:57:20] business more than a society. Um.

Payman Langroudi: You know, the one in Leeds was [00:57:25] the biggest Dental conference I’d ever been to. Wow. Yeah. I mean, I’ve been to [00:57:30] loads of Dental conferences, 25 years of Dental conferences. It was the biggest one I’ve ever been to. And the fact [00:57:35] the students pulled that off, it sort of gave me the warm and fuzzies, you [00:57:40] know? And by the way, a lot of it didn’t. But but but yeah, all events are like that. Yeah. [00:57:45] Yeah. Every, like every wedding, something goes wrong. Yeah. You know, in Arab weddings, they have this thing where they throw [00:57:50] the doves into the air.

Bashar Alturk: Okay.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, yeah. We. I got married in Beirut, and we threw the doves into the [00:57:55] air, and they just dropped on the ground. They didn’t fly.

Bashar Alturk: To [00:58:00] make you nervous.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, well, the wedding, I don’t care, but. But one [00:58:05] of the family was like, that’s a really bad omen. You have to do something now. No [00:58:10] way.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, but you laughed with it.

Payman Langroudi: I was cool, I was cool with it, I was cool. I’ve got that [00:58:15] sort of superstitious about doves flying. Yeah. But. Okay. Delegation.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. [00:58:20] Hard.

Payman Langroudi: You decided not to be such a nice guy, then?

Bashar Alturk: No, it took me.

Payman Langroudi: But doesn’t come naturally [00:58:25] to you. Not to be a nice guy.

Bashar Alturk: No. And it took me halfway through. I remember through presidency, and [00:58:30] there was things that was going wrong, and I sort of sat down and looked and I said, no, things have to go. [00:58:35] You have to be harsh sometimes. And I never understood it. I’ve worked I’ve worked for people before. [00:58:40] I’ve worked as a coach, and at times I’d watch stuff. And he’s quite harsh [00:58:45] on that person, or he’s let that person go and I’m really unsure why. So what did I learn? [00:58:50] I have to make everyone accountable. [00:58:55] If there’s a deadline set, no matter who that person is, the deadline is set. [00:59:00] The job has to be done by that point. Not to overtake everything as well, because there’ll [00:59:05] be times something’s not done.

Payman Langroudi: I’ll just do it myself.

Bashar Alturk: I’ll just do it myself. Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: So those two points are really [00:59:10] good points. Yeah. Your first one about having to be harsh. I get it if you’re a complete [00:59:15] doormat. Yeah. Yeah. And by the way, TSA like running something like [00:59:20] PDSA. Whenever I talk to students who are thinking about doing this sort of thing, I tell them 100%, do [00:59:25] it for the learnings. Yeah. The fact that those people are volunteers, they’re not employees. [00:59:30] Yes. Yeah. In a way, you haven’t got authority to tell them to do something. Yeah. [00:59:35] And and if you piss them off, they’ll just stop doing that thing altogether. Just walk out.

Bashar Alturk: Exactly.

Payman Langroudi: Employees [00:59:40] don’t really walk out unless you really piss them off big time. Yeah. So it’s a different you know, it’s a [00:59:45] harder thing than running a business in a way, because everyone’s kind of. On the other hand, there’s the sort [00:59:50] of purpose led part of it. Yeah. Yeah. And purpose is gigantic. [00:59:55] Yeah. Like if we’re all in it together, I don’t know, you know. Dentinal tubules.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: They’re [01:00:00] all in it together, man. It’s a massive, like thing. It’s like you [01:00:05] can you can reduce things down, can’t you? You can say, what does enlightened even do? Man, it [01:00:10] makes rich people’s teeth whiter.

Bashar Alturk: No.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. You could you could be reductive about it. Or [01:00:15] you can go a different direction. You can say, oh, the amount of joy if you whatever. You [01:00:20] know what I mean? Like the cumulative joy that enlightens brought into the world by making yeah, the humans [01:00:25] teeth or whatever smiles love all of that. Exactly. But when you’re [01:00:30] dealing with these students, it’s a funny thing, you know, uh, what [01:00:35] you said is brilliant. The thing about delegating and keeping people accountable. Unfortunately, [01:00:40] people like me and you, ADHD types. Yeah. Aren’t good at that second piece. Yeah. [01:00:45] We’re not good at keeping ourselves accountable, let alone keeping other people accountable. So did you find a technique [01:00:50] or tactics that you write everything down? Yeah. Like simple stuff [01:00:55] like that doesn’t come, come, come naturally to ADHD. No.

Bashar Alturk: It [01:01:00] was really hard. I had a great team as well behind me. And it’s again, it’s just [01:01:05] those who were around me. And the honest answer is no, I don’t think I found a tactic at the time, but I just [01:01:10] learned a lot.

Payman Langroudi: You should do.

Bashar Alturk: This. This should be done. So then I’d speak to someone else, and can [01:01:15] we make sure that this is also done at this point? And then make sure just, just conversation communication. And [01:01:20] I think that’s the massive power trait of ADHD is being able to effectively [01:01:25] just communicate with people. I found that, so it’s that side. But I [01:01:30] think with all of it, whether it was the essay or the lessons learned, it’s that sink or swim, again, [01:01:35] we made mistakes, a lot of mistakes, but sort of learned [01:01:40] from them. The same with the loops business. We made loads of mistakes in that business that I can take on to the next one. Um, [01:01:45] and I know that again, my personal belief is you need a team with you and around [01:01:50] you to help. If I don’t.

Payman Langroudi: Know, it’s so interesting when you’ve been involved in a few things like you’ve [01:01:55] been involved in, then you go to a Zara. Yeah. And [01:02:00] in Zara, if you’ve been involved in a few things, you start paying attention, you know, like what’s [01:02:05] the staff situation here? Like, why do they do this lighting design here? [01:02:10] Or it’s very easy just to walk in as a consumer and look at a shirt. Yeah. And I’ve [01:02:15] noticed here, people who haven’t been involved in events have no idea [01:02:20] what it takes. Even like someone very close to me who who should know [01:02:25] better. Yeah. Don’t understand at all. Yeah. Like the risk. Yeah. [01:02:30] The risk in every direction. Right. You know, there’s financial risk. There’s reputational risk. [01:02:35] There’s risk of disaster. Things going wrong, people not turning up. [01:02:40] All of that sort of thing that go go through it. For someone who’s [01:02:45] never done an event like your PDSA, what were the moving parts? Venue sponsored [01:02:50] one. There’s loads to it. There’s loads.

Bashar Alturk: Even. Let’s say something as amazing as this. They bring [01:02:55] it right back down to a Dental school ball.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. It’s incredible. Our Dental [01:03:00] ball ball cost us £23,000 as a student society. That’s. That’s money. It’s [01:03:05] incredible.

Payman Langroudi: It must be much more than that.

Bashar Alturk: It was a lot more.

Payman Langroudi: I must have been at least 100 over. [01:03:10]

Bashar Alturk: I mean, from ticket sales, you at least, you know, if you have 1000 students and you’re way [01:03:15] over over. Um, and I know even Liverpool this year did an amazing [01:03:20] job.

Payman Langroudi: Big, big.

Bashar Alturk: Event. They did even more, uh, numbers. Um, and these guys all were [01:03:25] all friends and they’ve, they’ve all done amazing.

Payman Langroudi: So with various elements, for someone who doesn’t understand what [01:03:30] events are.

Bashar Alturk: She needs sponsors. First of all, you need a venue, you need to place it somewhere. [01:03:35] You need people to attend. You need ticket sales where you want.

Payman Langroudi: Ticket ting, ticketing. [01:03:40]

Bashar Alturk: Ticketing. Where are you going to sell the tickets? You need a platform to sell the tickets. On what commission are they [01:03:45] going to take? How much is the event going to cost us? What’s the upfront cost? Sponsors.

Payman Langroudi: Uh cash [01:03:50] flow right. Cash flow is gigantic.

Bashar Alturk: Because you start from a pot of almost zero, pretty [01:03:55] much especially for like dent SoC. And I guess like BSA, you’ll have a small [01:04:00] budget to try and secure a deposit for a venue, but that’s it. And [01:04:05] to try and build something from the ground is, is, is incredibly difficult and [01:04:10] at times I’ve not been the best at it. And there’s people who have learned from who are, you know, who are, I’d [01:04:15] say, okay, yeah, I like how you’ve done that. I take it from it.

Payman Langroudi: And then I kind of took over [01:04:20] from you. Yeah. And I remember pastor telling me the water bill was like £1,000. [01:04:25] Yeah, yeah. For bottles of water. Yeah. Let alone bits of [01:04:30] furniture.

Bashar Alturk: Exactly.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. Tech. Tech. Yeah. Like those [01:04:35] screens you had.

Bashar Alturk: I remember that itself was, I think planning it [01:04:40] like 4050.

Payman Langroudi: For the tech.

Bashar Alturk: Piece. I’m pretty sure. Yeah, I remember [01:04:45] and then going yeah, so massive great friend of mine. And the way he sees stuff [01:04:50] sometimes compared to the way I see something completely different. And, and you learn [01:04:55] from, from it. So I’ve learned so much from pastor.

Payman Langroudi: I massively impressed by that.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. [01:05:00]

Payman Langroudi: And that’s how he keeps himself so calm. Yeah. Um, for, for a child [01:05:05] that’s not a bad man. Yeah. Not bad.

Bashar Alturk: So much props. We’ve had our graduation [01:05:10] ball, this, this that went over and um, at the weekend and the level [01:05:15] of detail. I even said.

Payman Langroudi: How did he do.

Bashar Alturk: That? Yeah, I even said, I said I wouldn’t have [01:05:20] been able to do this level of detail, but I think it’s fine. I think it comes back from going back to [01:05:25] sport and everything. I’m not going to be the best at everything, but learning [01:05:30] from those, I surround yourself with those who are good. You know, I’ve learned so much from from other people and, [01:05:35] and yeah, so, um, parson did like the latter half of the BSA and an [01:05:40] incredible job. Um and we learnt so much from that, that [01:05:45] process itself and yeah, it was good.

Payman Langroudi: Let’s go on to if [01:05:50] everything goes your way, who would you like to be in ten years time in dentistry? [01:05:55] Because you told me you love business. Yeah. You told me you kind [01:06:00] of like drilling teeth and stuff too. Yeah. Are you thinking, [01:06:05] what 50 practices guy? Or are you thinking like more like our [01:06:10] thing selling to dentists, selling to the what? Have you got any thoughts?

Bashar Alturk: Are [01:06:15] specialising not [01:06:20] sure about specialising. I think the goals I’ve set for myself and [01:06:25] I love the idea of reaching for the stars. Or is it aim for the moon and you [01:06:30] landing the stars and so yeah, I’d love to have a corporate is is the answer. [01:06:35] I’d love to have as many practices as possible. And that in itself is pretty difficult. [01:06:40]

Payman Langroudi: What is it about as many practices as possible that turns you on? Is it brand [01:06:45] recognition kind of story?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, I think that’s part of that. But [01:06:50] then again, there’s quality and there’s quantity, and there’s the debate between those.

Payman Langroudi: Is [01:06:55] it like, mum, I’ve made it kind of story?

Bashar Alturk: Definitely. That’s massive part really. Yeah, [01:07:00] massively. Mum sacrificed everything for us. Absolutely everything. So to be able [01:07:05] to show her anything of it. So like, I can’t wait to get my first paycheque and [01:07:10] do this thing of just handing it over. It’s, it’s.

Payman Langroudi: About the multiple [01:07:15] practices. Why does that turn you on?

Bashar Alturk: Just success. I think it’s always been I think [01:07:20] it does delve down to sport. And we were discussing all those really high, successful, high performing [01:07:25] people in dentistry. And maybe there is a void. I’m not sure. I’m not sure, but I want [01:07:30] to be the best. And why so.

Payman Langroudi: Many? But let me explain something to you. Like one of my dental [01:07:35] heroes, Andrew Darwood. Yeah. Uh, I mean, he’s massively [01:07:40] successful. There’s no there’s no success problem. Okay. There. He’s massively successful. [01:07:45] Um, he’s got one. I’m sure he’s got a few. He’s [01:07:50] got other, other, many, many other assets I’m sure. Yeah, yeah. But one extraordinary [01:07:55] 17 chair specialist centre in the West [01:08:00] End. One. Yeah. Yeah. And and his point of view [01:08:05] is it’s impossible to do two like this. Yeah. If you’re not in both places. Right. [01:08:10] I point out to him. Yeah. Louis Vuitton’s got shops all over the world. Right. They can manage it. Yeah. [01:08:15] But he’s kind of maybe saying this is more than it is. It’s like it’s implant [01:08:20] surgery. He does maxfax implants and this, that and the other. Yeah. He’s got a whole lot of stuff [01:08:25] going on. Yeah. But what my my general point to you is your mum will be just as proud of you if you’ve got one amazing [01:08:30] practice and or a hundred. Yeah. But yourself in terms of happiness. [01:08:35] Yeah. Some people get high on the notion of I’m this business executive [01:08:40] that goes around handling my 100 centres. Sounds [01:08:45] I like it like the sound of it. Yeah. Yeah. But there’s a lot of [01:08:50] pleasure in being the king of this one place where you’re looking [01:08:55] for perfection. Yeah. I’d say it’s a bit more like becoming that gymnast. [01:09:00] In one place, perfecting it, getting better every day, better every day. You [01:09:05] try and do it for 100 year. There’ll be there’ll be some embarrassing moments. Yeah, a bit, [01:09:10] a bit like that. Uh, you know, loops customer in Bulgaria who wasn’t happy or whatever. Yeah. [01:09:15] You know, so so what I’m saying is don’t necessarily script yourself into multiple locations [01:09:20] because sometimes, sometimes it’s a vanity metric. Yes. [01:09:25] Yeah. It’s, it’s something that sounds good. I agree sometimes.

Bashar Alturk: And [01:09:30] there’s probably an element to that. I’d love to be famous one [01:09:35] day. But yeah, I, yeah, there definitely is an element of it. And [01:09:40] it’s the death of financial element. I want to be successful. But and the honest [01:09:45] truth is the answer is I want to be able to do. I know there’s a level of wealth and above [01:09:50] that level of wealth, that happiness isn’t really going to come from that. Yeah, I [01:09:55] want to do good in the world is is the honest answer. Where do I want to open a charity I want. I [01:10:00] want to be able to have the opportunities to do something good. Do I need. [01:10:05] Do we need 100 practices? No. There’s probably other ways of going [01:10:10] around.

Payman Langroudi: Um, but listen, man, if it’s your dream, it’s your dream. Yeah. Like it might be. [01:10:15] It’s my dream to be a trampolinist. No no no. Yeah. It’s your dream. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Anything in business, I think, [01:10:20] is the answer. The idea is to, you know, if we go for 50 and we end up with three, [01:10:25] then then that’s more than enough.

Payman Langroudi: I like that, I like. So you’re saying just you want [01:10:30] you want to aim high. You want to live up to your potential.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, massively. Aim high and live up to all potential. [01:10:35] And if it’s in business or if it’s in dentistry or if it’s just being a family man, I think [01:10:40] all of them. I think that’s major teaching. I like [01:10:45] the idea of teaching. I mean, again, there is an element of selling a course, um, [01:10:50] but doing right by that course and having something to really sell. So we’ve discussed it. And I think next [01:10:55] year I’d love to open something for students to come and learn and practice a little bit further. Um. [01:11:00]

Payman Langroudi: Listen, I’ve had several students who’ve had communities, [01:11:05] businesses, things aimed at students. Yeah, yeah, it’s all well and good, but students [01:11:10] don’t have any money.

Bashar Alturk: No.

Payman Langroudi: True. Yeah. Communities are fine. But if you’re, you [01:11:15] know, if you’re excited by monetising something. Yeah. Even if it starts out with students [01:11:20] the same way as Conor did. Yeah. You you have it as some sort [01:11:25] of application to everyone. Yeah. So, you know, if your your business is called [01:11:30] student Phantom, whatever, that’s not going to work. You know, so, you know, think [01:11:35] of it like that. You know. Yes. Start on students, practice with students, whatever. Yeah. You know.

Bashar Alturk: But it [01:11:40] would be. Yeah. So if it was a course, I completely agree. It starts it starts with students. And then I guess it would go [01:11:45] those students graduate. And it’s been about building a reputation for those brands. [01:11:50] That’s obvious. I think that’s in the future with more experience.

Payman Langroudi: Um, so it seems to me [01:11:55] that you’ve got a notoriety. Kind of a missing piece. [01:12:00] That’s the wrong way to look at it. But notoriety, you want to be known?

Bashar Alturk: I’d [01:12:05] like to. Yeah, I think so.

Payman Langroudi: Is that your whole generation, or is that. Are you more than that? More than the average [01:12:10] Gen z Z alpha.

Bashar Alturk: Um.

Payman Langroudi: Like [01:12:15] why why do you want to be known, by the way? Look [01:12:20] at me. I’ve got a podcast. I got, you know, it’s just cool. I’m not, I’m not telling you off for wanting to be.

Bashar Alturk: No, no, not at all.

Payman Langroudi: But my, [01:12:25] my business partner, he, he’s the CEO of enlighten. You know, nobody knows who he is. He [01:12:30] doesn’t want to be known. Yeah. Do you have a feeling for why you want to be known?

Bashar Alturk: I’m not [01:12:35] sure. And again, there’s probably a vanity in that, but I [01:12:40] think I’ve done it before. So, for example, at university in like the first [01:12:45] month, because we were on a sports scholarship, we had to do a photo shoot for the university. And those photos were everywhere. [01:12:50] And so everyone would know you. And yes, it’s nice to be.

Payman Langroudi: Known on campus.

Bashar Alturk: Yes, unfortunately. Unfortunately. [01:12:55] Yeah. So it was, um, everyone would come up to you like, oh, you’re [01:13:00] that person. And yeah, there’s definitely an element of vanity in that sense. But [01:13:05] I also think you can impact a lot of people if you’re known people come to you, people ask you questions. [01:13:10] You can be kind to everyone. So for me, I’d spend time talking to every person [01:13:15] who ever came up to me and just being kind. I think being known, I guess, [01:13:20] is it a metric of success? Some some could say.

Payman Langroudi: When I was your age, I used [01:13:25] to think everything’s so rubbish. Okay. Yeah. And everything’s so rubbish. I want [01:13:30] to be impact. I want to make things better. Yeah. Do you feel everything’s rubbish? [01:13:35] I still think everything’s rubbish, by the way. Yes. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: I think there’s a lot of things that could be [01:13:40] improved in general. I mean even yesterday we attended a conference, a, [01:13:45] an adult conference, a dental conference and the British Society of Restorative Dentistry. [01:13:50] Oh, really?

Payman Langroudi: Um, that’s very high end.

Bashar Alturk: It was. It was just in Leeds. And they. [01:13:55] They asked a few of us at the University would you like to go attend? And so we attended and I sort of sat there [01:14:00] and the contacts way above our heads at the moment, but I was thinking [01:14:05] this could be improved a lot more and it was an amazing. It was a good event. I kept [01:14:10] thinking, right, we could improve here. We could do that. We could do this, this. We got almost had to hold myself [01:14:15] back before speaking to the the president saying like, because in the end, at the moment I’m a nobody. [01:14:20]

Payman Langroudi: The problem with events is, as I’m finding out at Ministry of Sound, the better the event is, the [01:14:25] more money you lose. Yes. Or the less money you make. Yeah. You know, like that’s, [01:14:30] that’s the issue with events. I mean, you could, you could say the same thing about products, but with events, there’s like a, like, listen, [01:14:35] my personal bugbear at events. Crap. Coffee. Yeah. Why can’t it be great coffee. [01:14:40] Now I’m finding out great coffee. 3500 pounds. Ridiculous. [01:14:45] And then it’s like, oh, do I spend that 3500 pounds on great coffee? Or do I spend it on something else? Something else? It’s [01:14:50] ridiculous. It’s it’s that sort of equation sometimes. [01:14:55] But, you know, like, you know, that notion of, um, the journey rather than [01:15:00] the destination. Yes. In gymnastics, did [01:15:05] you, you sound like you loved the journey. Absolutely. But it’s [01:15:10] very destination kind of determined as well because you’re going for that top level, [01:15:15] you know, intensity. You’ve got to enjoy the journey. Yeah. And enjoy it a little bit more. [01:15:20] Yeah. Than than gymnastics insomuch as see your friends, uh, make [01:15:25] friends, make friends in the first place. This thing you’re saying about this nuclear family that you’re interested [01:15:30] in. Yeah. It’s a massive issue. Yeah, it’s a massive issue. [01:15:35] Yeah. You can’t be away more than one weekend in three.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. And also, I want to. Not [01:15:40] just yet. Yeah. At some point. Yeah, I know massively.

Payman Langroudi: Um. [01:15:45] So let’s talk teeth now. Yeah. [01:15:50] Which aspects of the teeth do you like and which aspects don’t you like so far?

Bashar Alturk: So [01:15:55] at university, I was very lucky again. Communication [01:16:00] skills. I think we had the most amount of totals. Almost raised [01:16:05] an eyebrow at the time. I’m not going to say quality and quantity means quality. So [01:16:10] we got to see a vast array I think at dental school. We’ve done over 180 fillings [01:16:15] even, which I saw quite a lot. Um, pros. [01:16:20] I love doing crown preps, but I guess the other side of pros like dentures I’m not a fan of at [01:16:25] the moment.

Payman Langroudi: See like fixed pros.

Bashar Alturk: Yes. Fixed pros. Um, what I [01:16:30] really enjoyed was I got to do a tooth wear case at university. Um, and then we did a competition, [01:16:35] um like the like British undergraduate conference and we ended up winning that. Um, [01:16:40] and I think that’s the side of dentistry I really would like to go into because [01:16:45] just how holistic it is.

Payman Langroudi: What full mouth rehab? I think so, yeah. Okay. [01:16:50]

Bashar Alturk: Really, really enjoyed just just the difference you [01:16:55] could see from the start to the end how multidisciplinary it is and complex. [01:17:00] And almost I, from what I’ve understood and researched, quite risky. [01:17:05] You know.

Payman Langroudi: It’s dangerous, like not dangerous, but it’s important work.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. Important. [01:17:10] Yeah. Risky. And also I mean very, um, fortunate at the university. You know, [01:17:15] if a composite chips, I can replace it. I guess in practice that’s a cost that you’re going [01:17:20] to have to factor in and if everything keeps failing. Um, I learnt a lot from. [01:17:25]

Payman Langroudi: Interested in blood.

Bashar Alturk: I would love to go into like maxfax [01:17:30] and that sort of stuff in general.

Payman Langroudi: I mean blood could be perio. It could be implants. [01:17:35]

Bashar Alturk: Implants for sure.

Payman Langroudi: But blood, you know, like you have to be for something like implants. [01:17:40] You’d be very happy with flaps bone. Yeah. Uh, it’s very like, you know, [01:17:45] again, high risk work. Insomuch as you know, things can go even further wrong. Yeah. [01:17:50] Are you. You’re up for that, right?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. More than happy. I spoke to we don’t do many service [01:17:55] calls at university, so I spoke. We finished. We graduated this week. Um, and I spoke to one of the consultants [01:18:00] said, please, can I come in and just learn how to do a surgical extraction before I leave? And [01:18:05] so yeah, I think on that side I’d be really happy.

Payman Langroudi: Um, listen, I mean, [01:18:10] I did max fax house job. Yeah. In your world, that would be called what they call it [01:18:15] something else. Now.

Bashar Alturk: Um.

Payman Langroudi: Dct, DCT there. I was very [01:18:20] happy to watch this guy cutting off a bit of the guy’s foot and stick it in his jaw and all that. But [01:18:25] the doing piece here, and I did, I did some of the, um, you know, A&E [01:18:30] stitching faces. Yeah. In the middle of the night. I hated that. But [01:18:35] listen, if you don’t mind blood implants for sure, man. Jump jump [01:18:40] in, jump in now. Yeah. I’d say make some decisions now. [01:18:45] Not the corporate 100 practices type decisions. You get to that, by the way. Yeah. [01:18:50] Yeah. But for now, jump into one of these aspects. They’re kind [01:18:55] of different full mouth rehab and kind of but you know, sometimes it’s the same patient, often it’s [01:19:00] the same patient. So you have to understand restorative to do implants.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, exactly. No, I [01:19:05] think the implant side, like I said, like the full mouth rehab, but the implant side I really looked into [01:19:10] understanding I’ve had, and I don’t know your opinion on it is like you said, just jump in. And I spoke to some people [01:19:15] and it’s start tomorrow. Yeah. You know, don’t wait around for five, six years. Go [01:19:20] and learn. Learn.

Payman Langroudi: I think I also don’t want people to think that if they [01:19:25] do nothing for five years, it’s a bad thing, you know? [01:19:30] Yeah. It’s not. No no, no. Let’s say you’re super tired. Yeah. Let’s say [01:19:35] you struggled. Not you. Someone else. Yeah. Struggle through dental school. Super tired [01:19:40] now? Yeah. All right. Spend four years doing simple [01:19:45] stuff. Keep everything simple. Yeah. The only trap is to. Then if that carries on, you [01:19:50] know, and it can. And and then you start to hate work because you’re not getting better at it. Yeah, but [01:19:55] it shouldn’t feel too bad. Take three years off and then do something. But okay, my [01:20:00] general advice is pick something and dive in. Okay. You know, so like, let’s say it’s [01:20:05] implants, you know, really go talk, shake hands, shadow start. [01:20:10] Let’s say, let’s put your first implant in by this time, you know, like it’s [01:20:15] good advice to like, really focus in on one of them. Yeah. But like, I don’t know, trampoline [01:20:20] over was the ring. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, yeah. Well [01:20:25] we’ll see. Give us a if we ever speak again on the podcast in, in ten years time, what sort [01:20:30] of difference would be? And then where, where we actually, it takes.

Payman Langroudi: Ten years to [01:20:35] become a really good dentist.

Bashar Alturk: Okay.

Payman Langroudi: It does. Um, by [01:20:40] that time, maybe you’re on practice 73.

Bashar Alturk: No.

Payman Langroudi: See, look, we like to talk about mistakes on [01:20:45] this board. Yeah. Clinical errors. I like I’m [01:20:50] interested in other kinds of mistakes you’ve made. What comes to mind when I say that?

Bashar Alturk: They [01:20:55] call errors straight away. Comes out to me is is that [01:21:00] over over promising over attaching myself to the [01:21:05] patient that that need and want to do the best for the patient can be very [01:21:10] detrimental at times. Um, and I think it’s led against like [01:21:15] loss of confidence sometimes and not being able to deliver it at the moment. It’s been great because I’ve learned a [01:21:20] lot from it and been able to learn different things clinically. [01:21:25] I mean, I remember the first first ever in there. I did, um, I fractured a file in the apical [01:21:30] third, um, of, of, of the canal.

Payman Langroudi: Um, that’s all right.

Bashar Alturk: It was, [01:21:35] they couldn’t get out um at the time. Um but That was probably the worst [01:21:40] thing I’ve ever done on clinics at the moment, but I was very happy to do [01:21:45] it, in a sense, and we consented the patient for the risks and explained the, the process after [01:21:50] um and I learnt a lot and I think I’m sure it will happen again [01:21:55] at some point. I’d say that’s my Dental clinical mistake. Um. [01:22:00] In life. I [01:22:05] think it has two sides to the coin. Is that sort of that [01:22:10] want and need to learn and just jumping in the sink or swim [01:22:15] mentality. It can be massively advantageous. It’s put me in rooms [01:22:20] and places in positions where, you know, I’ve learnt so much compared [01:22:25] to someone who hadn’t put themselves in that position, especially, for example, like the loops company at the moment. [01:22:30] Um, it caused me a lot of lot of issues at the time.

Payman Langroudi: Um, how far did you get with that, by the [01:22:35] way?

Bashar Alturk: We, we sold loads, we sold about 60 and then the school put a stop to it at the time. [01:22:40]

Payman Langroudi: School figured it out.

Bashar Alturk: They they weren’t happy with with it. Students buying, [01:22:45] coming back and complications of it at a time and had to [01:22:50] go through a whole procedure, um, of, of explaining it to a board and, and like school warnings, [01:22:55] etc. and we, we said at the time.

Payman Langroudi: What [01:23:00] was it, what was it?

Bashar Alturk: Loss of argument of my payment, um.

Payman Langroudi: Or [01:23:05] failure to thrive clause that one.

Bashar Alturk: They quoted some of the GDC [01:23:10] principles.

Payman Langroudi: Just to practice.

Bashar Alturk: Yes. And a sense of like, well, if you’re going to focus [01:23:15] on why you’re not focusing on dentistry, which I wasn’t, and it was the fact [01:23:20] that you’re not a salesman.

Payman Langroudi: Were you failing dentistry?

Bashar Alturk: No, [01:23:25] no, no, no. I was, you know, as hard as I found, dental school has been very, very fortunate. Touch wood. That [01:23:30] was doing very well. I mean, clinically, it it it was raising eyebrows [01:23:35] of what we were doing in the cases, etc. and they were all doing. I mean, under the guidance of the tutor. [01:23:40] And he was very happy. Those who worked with me loved me.

Payman Langroudi: How long did it take you to sell [01:23:45] 60. Like, how long was it from beginning to the end [01:23:50] of that business? A year longer.

Bashar Alturk: Year and a half. No, 60 or 60 [01:23:55] sales as well. Those would be 60 pairs of loops that have left us in [01:24:00] that sense. Some sales, some give us [01:24:05] some at cost price to friends. Just trying to get loops out there. [01:24:10] And I think I’ve still got probably 62 was the order. I think [01:24:15] I’ve probably still got 8 or 9 just sat in my room at the moment. Just, yeah, just just [01:24:20] just sat there and something to consider in the future, um, of [01:24:25] going back to it. Um, but again, I don’t, don’t regret it at all. It caused [01:24:30] me a lot of stress in fifth year going through all that, all, all the stress.

Payman Langroudi: To business turnover [01:24:35] was like ten zero zero £0.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, we’re free as well. [01:24:40] I think if we go I see I wasn’t involved with the accounts, which was which was good. I [01:24:45] was good and bad. I was the face of it being the face of it in the Dental. The [01:24:50] other two boys weren’t dentists. They would come back and um, all [01:24:55] the issues would come to me. Yeah. Because I was the the dental person. Yeah. So yeah, [01:25:00] it was hard. Um, but it allowed us and I bought a pair of loops that I use at the [01:25:05] moment and we learnt a lot from it, but it was, it’s definitely hard. It’s hard [01:25:10] as you know, it’s hard to set a business up and I’m sure you’ve probably set others that no [01:25:15] one perfect.

Payman Langroudi: Who focussed on this one. Um, but yeah, [01:25:20] I lost money for some years. For the first three years we lost money. Yeah. For years and [01:25:25] then for another 3 or 4 years after that. Not making much money. Yeah. Um, not everyone’s like that [01:25:30] though. When you talk to some people, they like profitable day one. There’s some people are just real talent. Yeah, some businesses [01:25:35] are more like that. You know, if it’s not a product business. Yeah. If it’s a service business. Yeah. You know, like [01:25:40] it could be education. I got ten people in the room. Now they’re all paying. If I had eight people [01:25:45] in the room, I’d just cancelled the whole event and give everyone their money back. You know, like, you know, you can’t be that way. [01:25:50] Yeah. Um, what comes to mind if I ask you, what’s your favourite resource [01:25:55] in dentistry?

Bashar Alturk: Uh.

Payman Langroudi: Website, [01:26:00] maybe a Instagram or.

Bashar Alturk: Website or.

Payman Langroudi: Instagram [01:26:05] page or a book.

Bashar Alturk: Massive. So with the training, [01:26:10] travelling hours per day, so podcasts, like you said, your podcast, massive fan, listen [01:26:15] to loads of them. Um, you said jazz.

Payman Langroudi: Jazz. Yeah. Very good, very [01:26:20] good, but incredible podcast.

Bashar Alturk: So the Protrusive dental podcast, just learning little, little. [01:26:25] That’s it with dentistry I found, oh, even support with trampoline little just a little bit [01:26:30] And our podcast.

Payman Langroudi: Doesn’t do trampoline podcasts as well.

Bashar Alturk: No, there isn’t any at the moment. [01:26:35] And there isn’t. There isn’t one. I’d love to start a podcast at some point. Um, but there [01:26:40] isn’t many YouTube I found for students. I was, I was, you [01:26:45] know, sometimes I had like third year students coming up and wanting to use that tool to phantom head in my room and said, like, I’ve got a test [01:26:50] tomorrow. Please can we just borrow it for a bit? And I’m like, yeah, of course you can. And I’ll sit there and I’ll actually teach. And I [01:26:55] almost feel like a fraud because in the honest truth, what do I know at the moment? But, um, [01:27:00] I’m.

Payman Langroudi: Just watching this idea, like in your student room.

Bashar Alturk: Two free.

Payman Langroudi: Youtube for [01:27:05] kids drilling genuinely.

Bashar Alturk: And, um, yeah, [01:27:10] YouTube’s incredible resource. Just searching for particular procedures and there’s like Stevenson [01:27:15] Dental solutions. They’re very good. Just, just, just learning. And I think that for any resource, [01:27:20] put yourself even with the restorative, um, conference yesterday, 90% [01:27:25] of it’s going to fly over my head, but that one little bit will make the 6 or 7 hours or so [01:27:30] worth it. So I think so.

Payman Langroudi: It’s funny, I’ve been telling I’ve been telling these speakers for ministry. They’ve [01:27:35] only got 20 minutes for their lectures. Cool. Yeah. I was saying that that one little bit that everyone bangs [01:27:40] on about. Yeah. If they get 1 or 2 little bits from each speaker. [01:27:45] Yeah. Yeah. Because it’s 20 minutes. There’s a lot of speakers going out. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: That’s incredibly smart. [01:27:50] Those 20 minutes, your audience will be captivated for difficult.

Payman Langroudi: As a speaker, it’s very difficult. [01:27:55] The shorter it is, the more difficult it is. I can imagine you have to take stuff out.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: And, you know, [01:28:00] like there’s there’s Andrew Darwin’s going to be speaking. He’s doing this mass massive. Like, [01:28:05] uh, I’ve told him, I’ve asked him, can you do something maxillofacial? Okay. [01:28:10] And just like talking about it will take your time.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, I can imagine.

Payman Langroudi: Um, [01:28:15] but I, it’s interesting, like to introspect. Yeah. When, when you think about talking about dentistry, [01:28:20] introspect and think, what is my 1 or 2 contributions [01:28:25] to this whole narrative. Yeah. And you’ll appreciate you’re a bit too early [01:28:30] in dentistry, but you’ll appreciate in trampoline. Yeah. There is 1 or 2 things that’s [01:28:35] you. Yeah. You know that it’s your innovation. Yeah. And that’s really [01:28:40] the difference between a teacher and all the rest of us who are not such great teachers, is that [01:28:45] they’ve got more of those 1 or 2. They’ve got 4 or 5 things that they’ve come up with themselves [01:28:50] that, you know, it’s a really interesting thing to think about that, you know, what is the 1 or [01:28:55] 2 things that you’ve put into the world? Yeah, yeah. And I can see from your the way you’re talking, [01:29:00] you’re definitely that sort of Steve Jobs kind of. No, no, not, not that you [01:29:05] are. But Steve Jobs has this thing about you can make a dent in the world. Yeah, yeah. Like [01:29:10] the same thing I was saying to you. You can walk to Zara and pick a shirt up, or you can walk into [01:29:15] Zara and say, what are they doing here? You know? You know what Dental are they putting into the world? Yeah. [01:29:20] What comes to mind when I ask you, what’s the best lecture you’ve been to? Lecturer.

Bashar Alturk: It’s [01:29:25] a big, big question. Payman because there’s a lot of times [01:29:30] I’ll sit and look at the lecture and switch off within a couple of minutes.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. I mean, the education system [01:29:35] doesn’t cater for loads of people with ADHD kind of thing. No. [01:29:40] Low concentration types?

Bashar Alturk: No.

Payman Langroudi: What does come to mind? Even like [01:29:45] Ted talk. Tell me like something. Like something not Dental.

Bashar Alturk: I mean, honest [01:29:50] answer genuinely is podcast like these, you know, Dental Leaders the protrusive one itself. [01:29:55] I can tune in. I find it very.

Payman Langroudi: Very good.

Bashar Alturk: Very, very.

Payman Langroudi: Good. His [01:30:00] voice is brilliant for that.

Bashar Alturk: So calming. Yeah. Um, conferences. [01:30:05] I remember watching Amit Patel at um, [01:30:10] PDSA one year and it was just very, uh, [01:30:15] implants at the time. Perio implants. He’s a cool dude. He was very, very cool. And that’s [01:30:20] it captivated the audience just the way he spoke. Yeah. Interactive wasn’t [01:30:25] too serious. I think that was the main thing. And it just [01:30:30] involved the audience and in genuine that’s [01:30:35] the word, I think, for all of you, whether it’s yourself or whether it was Amit Patel, it’s it’s [01:30:40] just been genuine. And you can tell that through a podcast or a lecture or a podcast. [01:30:45]

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Bashar Alturk: You can, you can tell.

Payman Langroudi: Final question. Fancy [01:30:50] dinner party, three guests dead or alive. [01:30:55] Are you having.

Bashar Alturk: Oh, I’ve been debating and debating [01:31:00] debating it for like the past two weeks even. I was driving, I was walking on here. We’d gone [01:31:05] to the to the wrong building. I said to my mum, oh, I’m still not sure the first one would be [01:31:10] my grandfather. Um.

Payman Langroudi: Dad’s mom’s.

Bashar Alturk: Dad. Mom’s dad. Yeah. Never [01:31:15] met him, never met him. He.

Payman Langroudi: The stories were the legends about him.

Bashar Alturk: He sounds [01:31:20] like an absolute incredible person, and I think I would have had a lot to learn from him. He [01:31:25] he was like the Minister of Industry in industrial [01:31:30] in Jordan.

Payman Langroudi: He oh, in government he yeah. He was a [01:31:35] businessman before that.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. He he he sorted like loads of factories out. He was the first [01:31:40] to send his sisters like. So he sent all his sisters to university and all his [01:31:45] like all the girls, he was a big pioneer of of that side and you know, education first. [01:31:50] Um and he was ill during the whole time. So he had pulmonary fibrosis [01:31:55] at the time. And so my mum lost him very young, but [01:32:00] the stories of what he did and how modern his way [01:32:05] of thinking was at that time, I love to have a conversation with him and [01:32:10] just sounds amazing. And I just learned he was an not RAF, he was, [01:32:15] um, an engineer in the Army as well. So I think, yeah, it’d [01:32:20] be really cool to learn from him. Second one for me. I love boxing and [01:32:25] would be Muhammad Ali. Um, just for what he stands for.

Payman Langroudi: He was so much more than boxing, [01:32:30] wasn’t he?

Bashar Alturk: But so much more.

Payman Langroudi: Because I hate boxing. But but Muhammad Ali I love. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: It’s [01:32:35] just the adversities. And you know during that period what he had [01:32:40] to overcome I incredible. Third [01:32:45] one I struggled with a lot. Um for me [01:32:50] is is dong dong. It’s um, he’s like a five. His [01:32:55] name’s dong dong a Chinese.

Payman Langroudi: Dong.

Bashar Alturk: Dong dong dong dong dong dong.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Chinese jumping. [01:33:00]

Payman Langroudi: Oh, really?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. Um. World champion. Olympic [01:33:05] champion. Multiple. Um, like multiple Olympic medallists. Just incredible. [01:33:10] He is the pioneer of the sport. Um.

Payman Langroudi: When was it around? When [01:33:15] was.

Bashar Alturk: He. He won his first medal in 2008 and his last 1 in [01:33:20] 2020. Um and through he Olympic medal we’re talking it dominated [01:33:25] the sport. And and now he’s a coach. But just he [01:33:30] was incredible. And um we’ve been in the same room at times. So I’m hoping to get the conversation [01:33:35] at some point. Um, last time we were in China. Um yeah.

Payman Langroudi: What’s [01:33:40] China like? Have you been there recently?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. So we went there in [01:33:45] 2023.

Payman Langroudi: It’s unbelievable. Now it’s it’s looks futuristic. That’s [01:33:50] it.

Bashar Alturk: Really genuinely that’s it. It’s a different world. It’s like London massively [01:33:55] busy populated. People are genuinely lovely. But [01:34:00] just the technology and how quick they can put buildings up and things. It [01:34:05] was, you know, the the Olympic Village that we, we, we stayed in um for the Asian Games. [01:34:10] They built a whole village for, for these athletes within like a [01:34:15] year. It was, it was, it was incredible. And I remember there was like a there was a robot and I was playing tennis [01:34:20] against a robot in a.

Payman Langroudi: Really, really, really.

Bashar Alturk: So which yeah, it was, it’s [01:34:25] an incredible. Um.

Payman Langroudi: What’s the experience of being in that sort of Asian [01:34:30] Games village or whatever? What’s that feel like? Is it fun in itself just being there? [01:34:35]

Bashar Alturk: It’s it’s insane.

Payman Langroudi: You give yourself the time to enjoy it or you sort of focussed [01:34:40] on the I loved it.

Bashar Alturk: No, I love up until the day before the competition, I loved it.

Payman Langroudi: Stop [01:34:45] and smell the roses.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, it’s genuinely. Everyone from different countries, different [01:34:50] kits.

Payman Langroudi: Has everyone meeting and happy to meet and.

Bashar Alturk: Everyone’s happy to meet. Um, [01:34:55] massive like Food Village and the Food Village itself is incredible. Like as much [01:35:00] KFC, McDonald’s, like all these like just and foods as much as you wanted activities [01:35:05] to do the way you treated like a VIP, [01:35:10] staying in these really nice places and walking into that, like the, the Chinese [01:35:15] people really treated you as a celebrity. So I was walking around and people were asking for my signatures. I was like, [01:35:20] uh, yeah, I’m just like, uh, okay. And yeah, [01:35:25] it’s a competition on that level. It’s just amazing. You go and watch [01:35:30] other sports so you go support other sports as well. It’s such an experience, but absolutely [01:35:35] like petrifying at the same time.

Payman Langroudi: Petrifying what? [01:35:40] The actual competing piece.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. I remember the day before just almost like just being in tears from the pressure. Like [01:35:45] just, just I remember I met like the queen, uh, sorry, the princess of Jordan. They, they came [01:35:50] to watch me, um, at the time, but like that didn’t add pressure, but it was just the whole [01:35:55] event and you really feel.

Payman Langroudi: So were you Jordan, at this point?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. So that was what I was. I moved over [01:36:00] to Jordan after the injury.

Payman Langroudi: Before that you were Great Britain?

Bashar Alturk: Yes. I represented Great Britain and England at the [01:36:05] time.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah. So interesting man. And the sort [01:36:10] of overall feeling is like massively positive. Or do some people not not find [01:36:15] it positive? Some people not enjoy being there.

Bashar Alturk: I think I [01:36:20] think those who go to that, I.

Payman Langroudi: Mean, the pressure, if it’s bringing you to tears. Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah, [01:36:25] I.

Payman Langroudi: Remember it’s such an agony and ecstasy kind of thing.

Bashar Alturk: I think those of that [01:36:30] competition would have I assume a lot of them would enjoy it. Yeah. I think I’ve seen so many people [01:36:35] who can’t handle the pressure and that’s okay. There’s different avenues. Um, who [01:36:40] are talented and can’t handle the pressure leave the sport earlier. I think when you get to that stage, [01:36:45] you’ve already qualified, you’ve done big events before to get to, to the competition of that [01:36:50] calibre. I think a lot of them would would enjoy it.

Payman Langroudi: Scratched your itch a little bit for [01:36:55] the whole being famous piece, right?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah.

Payman Langroudi: But tell me the feeling of when someone gives you a medal [01:37:00] at the end of some competition that you’ve worked your butt off for. Is it relief? Is it what [01:37:05] is it like? What’s that feeling feel like.

Bashar Alturk: Pure joy of the [01:37:10] event. And you do really enjoy it When you finish the routine and you know you’re in cameras, [01:37:15] you see yourself on the screen and you get the score and you’re with your coach and you’ve won. It’s just amazing. [01:37:20] Even even though I came sixth in Asia, so I didn’t even win at that point.

Payman Langroudi: That’s big.

Bashar Alturk: As well. That was the you know, I even [01:37:25] FaceTimed my parents at the time whilst I was in the arena and oh, it was, it was a massive [01:37:30] experience. It was, it was really good, honest answer. And maybe as cliche as it [01:37:35] sounds, the medal. No one cares. You’ll sit there.

Payman Langroudi: The item.

Bashar Alturk: The actual [01:37:40] item. Yeah. The all in my room.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, yeah.

Bashar Alturk: You’ll never ever look at it [01:37:45] again. And it is that the journey up to there, the moment of everyone.

Payman Langroudi: But [01:37:50] is there an element of relief or is it, is it just just excitement?

Bashar Alturk: Um, [01:37:55] all excitement up until maybe an hour or two after the [01:38:00] event. And then it’s the relief at the time.

Payman Langroudi: And then when you come back and your mum says, take the rubbish [01:38:05] bin out, that must be a real downer.

Bashar Alturk: It’s hard, especially the third year. So third year I went to the Asian [01:38:10] Games. It took me months. I really.

Bashar Alturk: Really, really, really.

Bashar Alturk: Months. You [01:38:15] on such a high. You almost not in contact with anyone on the outside [01:38:20] world. Sport, sport, train, focus, sport and you’re there for, you know, you’re there for two weeks, [01:38:25] um, give or take like the whole from opening ceremony to the closing ceremony. And [01:38:30] so you live in this bubble and you leave and it’s massive part of my life. I know trampolines, not football, but [01:38:35] for me, it was incredible. Everything. It was everything. So coming back and even going back to [01:38:40] training, it’s like, well, it takes a while. It’s like, well, and there’s a lot of athletes that talk about sort [01:38:45] of like a, a depression period after major events because they’re not [01:38:50] sure what to do with themselves. And I found it hard.

Payman Langroudi: Like it’s real, man. I even come back from mini smart about [01:38:55] a composite. Yeah. Hands on course. Yeah, yeah. And that night when I’m taking the rubbish out, I feel a bit poor. A bit low. [01:39:00] Yeah.

Bashar Alturk: Like holiday blues.

Payman Langroudi: Yeah, yeah.

Bashar Alturk: But amplified because.

Payman Langroudi: Times [01:39:05] a thousand.

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. Because everything had worked to for me, I’d achieved at that point. [01:39:10] I’d lived that dream for me and I was like, well.

Payman Langroudi: What now?

Bashar Alturk: Yeah. [01:39:15] Like, I mean, there’s so much, if you really want it to look like nowhere near the best in the [01:39:20] world. But for me, it was good. Um, yeah, it’s [01:39:25] it’s hard.

Payman Langroudi: I’ve really enjoyed this, man. It’s been a massive pleasure. Learned a lot from you. Thank [01:39:30] you. Brilliant mindset. You’ve got brilliant, brilliant mind. I’m really looking forward to seeing how you develop. Um, [01:39:35] but make sure you stay in touch.

Bashar Alturk: No, massively, massively appreciate being here. And I’ve. I’ve loved [01:39:40] it and all the waffle I’ve said. So thank you so much.

Payman Langroudi: Amazing.

Bashar Alturk: Thank you.

Prav Solanki: Thanks [01:39:45] for listening guys. Hope you enjoyed today’s episode. Make sure you tune in for future episodes. [01:39:50] Hit subscribe in iTunes or Google Play or whatever platform it is. And [01:39:55] you know, we really, really appreciate it. If you would, um, give us.

Payman Langroudi: A six star rating. [01:40:00]

Prav Solanki: Six star rating. That’s what I always leave my Uber driver.

Payman Langroudi: Thanks [01:40:05] a lot, guys.

Prav Solanki: Bye.