Speaker1: Mindset and mindset shift, which is a huge part of self leadership. You’ve [00:00:05] got to be able to understand that, because a lot of what the habits that are already set in us is [00:00:10] from experience and from previous beliefs, right? And the good thing [00:00:15] is the brain is mouldable and that there are strategies on how you can change [00:00:20] that mindset and make that shift. But look, I mean payment, you have [00:00:25] to realise that you want the change first, right? You have to realise, [00:00:30] you know, where is it you want to go, what kind of life do you really want to live? [00:00:35] Right? And once you have that set in stone, then you’re ready [00:00:40] to then use all the strategies from self leadership, create that mindset change. [00:00:45] And then it’s all about intentionality, accountability, responsibility [00:00:50] and then moving on from there.

Speaker2: This [00:00:55] is Dental Leaders, the [00:01:00] podcast where you get to go one on one with emerging leaders in dentistry. [00:01:05] Your hosts Payman [00:01:10] Langroudi and Prav Solanki.

Speaker3: It gives me great pleasure to [00:01:15] welcome Doctor Sarika Shah onto the podcast. Sarika is the principal at [00:01:20] platinum Dental care, which is one of the most beautiful practices I’ve ever been to. [00:01:25] But not not only from the way it looks, but from the way it runs. A happy team, [00:01:30] lots of patients. Very, very impressive place in the Docklands. [00:01:35] Sarika is also now on a journey of self-development. [00:01:40] And looking at your poster, you guys, I see they’re becoming more and more inspirational [00:01:45] as as we go, and I’m really keen to get into that story as well. Welcome to the podcast. [00:01:50]

Speaker1: Thank you so much and it’s such a pleasure to be here today. So thank you for having me. [00:01:55]

Speaker4: Welcome to Rekha. And certainly from my point of view, I guess because my head’s in that [00:02:00] space, right? And it goes in and out of that space. Right. This personal development, self-help, wanting [00:02:05] to be the best version of you. And then, you know, whenever I come across [00:02:10] your stories or your posts and things like that, you’re definitely putting out there [00:02:15] a lot of positivity. But before we get into that, I want to [00:02:20] take us right back to the beginning. Your childhood, your upbringing, where you were born, [00:02:25] what that was like parents strict, not non strict. We were [00:02:30] really, really studious person to take us. Take us back to your upbringing. Give us your earliest [00:02:35] memories of what childhood was like.

Speaker1: Brilliant. Well, I [00:02:40] was very privileged to have grown up in Kenya with a very [00:02:45] stable family background, and it was just such a wonderful [00:02:50] place to grow up, you know, great weather, a lot of outdoors and a close knit [00:02:55] family. And I would also say that I think I’m very grateful [00:03:00] for the privileged upbringing that I’ve had as well. I have a lot of happy [00:03:05] childhood memories from my education, from my school days, as well [00:03:10] as being at home. And in terms of my upbringing, I’d say that [00:03:15] my parents weren’t very strict. I mean, they created boundaries [00:03:20] at home, and they ensured that we grew up with really good values [00:03:25] and that, you know, especially valuing our education. I think that was [00:03:30] really important to them because they worked so hard to be able to give us our education. [00:03:35] And I remember my dad saying to me that, you know, out of everything in this world, [00:03:40] the one thing I can give you is your education. So [00:03:45] had a fantastic childhood until the age of 16 when I finished my GCSEs, [00:03:50] and then I moved to the UK and I spent my last two years of [00:03:55] sixth form in a boarding school in Kent, which was [00:04:00] very interesting because it was so different. I was completely ripped away from [00:04:05] my comfort zone, and I was suddenly forced to be in an environment [00:04:10] where I had to grow up really quickly. This was a country that I [00:04:15] never. I’d been to England once in my life before, so it was in a country that I’d lived in [00:04:20] before. The weather was so different and I was almost forced to [00:04:25] make new friendships, new relationships. And I’d probably say [00:04:30] that that was the first time I remember being or starting [00:04:35] my self-development journey. And that was from the age of 16, because I was put [00:04:40] in this position where I had to really learn and grow up [00:04:45] at such a fast pace and become independent.

Speaker4: Any siblings? Sarika, did [00:04:50] you did you come with brother or sister or anything like that? Were you only child? What was the.

Speaker1: Yeah [00:04:55] so.

Speaker4: Situation. I have a younger brother.

Speaker1: There’s about a five and a half years difference [00:05:00] between us. Um, but when I moved to the UK, I was I was on my own. I [00:05:05] didn’t have a lot of close family in London, so it was. It was completely starting [00:05:10] from scratch for me. It was a new phase of my life and one that I am so [00:05:15] appreciative of because I feel that that was when I started [00:05:20] really learning who I was and, you know, understanding [00:05:25] a sense of self. And I think it really began if I reflect, that’s how it began that early on for me. [00:05:30]

Speaker4: And and can you remember the time that your parents said, [00:05:35] we’re going to send you to the UK? Like, like, how did that come about? And [00:05:40] what was your what was going through your mind at the time or, or was it always going [00:05:45] to happen anyway?

Speaker1: Yeah. You know, I think my parents are quite intuitive in that sense because [00:05:50] they saw that, almost saw that I wanted and needed more [00:05:55] from what my education and what my environment was giving me then. And [00:06:00] my uncle had been to the school many, many years ago. Uh, and my mum said [00:06:05] to me, I remember her having a conversation. She said. Well, you know, this is an option for you. And at [00:06:10] that time, I was actually instead of A levels that my school was providing, I was actually looking at [00:06:15] doing the International Baccalaureate. And, and I remember my mom saying to me that, you [00:06:20] know, this could be fantastic and would you be up for this? And I just thought, [00:06:25] so scary, but yet so exciting. And I will never forget that [00:06:30] emotion and the feeling that I had sitting at that dining table is such a distinct memory in my life [00:06:35] and thinking that, wow, like what a huge opportunity this could, [00:06:40] this could be so incredible for me. I’m so I’m so [00:06:45] happy that I made that choice. And I’m so I’m so over the moon at that time. I think looking [00:06:50] back, I’m so happy that my parents supported me through that as well, you know, and [00:06:55] sent me and allowed me to go through this next phase of my life at that point.

Speaker3: Circa [00:07:00] as a as a person of your stature, let’s say, in Kenya, [00:07:05] if, let’s say in that sliding doors moment, you hadn’t decided to go, have [00:07:10] you reflected on where you would be now and who you would be? And.

Speaker1: Uh, [00:07:15] I feel that. I feel that whatever has [00:07:20] happened in terms of my life journey and who I am would [00:07:25] still have happened, but maybe not have happened as quickly, because I think [00:07:30] that by going abroad at such a young age, when I was 16 [00:07:35] and really coming out of my comfort zone, everything I had known wasn’t [00:07:40] had disappeared. And and like I said, it made [00:07:45] me grow up really quickly. But I think that, you know, I’ve always been someone that [00:07:50] is a little bit spiritual that wants to learn and grow and had [00:07:55] ambition and wanted to just take on all these challenges. [00:08:00] I think that’s within me, you know? So I think that if [00:08:05] the situation had been the other way around and I’d stayed in Kenya, my life would have been different [00:08:10] and I think I would have just been on this path. But a little bit later.

Speaker3: Do [00:08:15] you remember dentistry coming into the equation? At what age that was?

Speaker1: Absolutely. [00:08:20] So do you know that, um, dentistry [00:08:25] for me was probably one of the first autonomous [00:08:30] decisions that I made in my life, and I’ve never regretted [00:08:35] it when I was in boarding school. You know, all my family, they’ve all [00:08:40] got a business background. So it was almost like. It was almost like it was [00:08:45] expected of me to go in that direction. And then I realised when I was, [00:08:50] you know, when I was choosing my subjects and when I was sitting my exams, that I started to understand [00:08:55] and reflect on what I was good at and what I wasn’t good at. And I remember [00:09:00] having a conversation with my teachers and my parents. Remember, this was this was like 25 years [00:09:05] ago, right? There was, um, there was no WhatsApp. There was this calling scratch card [00:09:10] in, in the telephone booth. Um, and, you know, my parents weren’t there, [00:09:15] so I wasn’t really influenced in that sense directly, you know, by [00:09:20] by them and what they thought about career choices at the time. So [00:09:25] at this time I thought, well, great, I’ve got the opportunity to choose exactly what [00:09:30] I wanted to do. And it suddenly transitioned from moving from [00:09:35] like, almost like a business management, that type of degree to then me having a conversation. [00:09:40] Well, I’m really good at science and I’m a trained Indian classical dancer. I [00:09:45] was a really good artist and I thought, well, I’ve got the dexterity skills, so what could I [00:09:50] what could I do that where I could use my skills? And [00:09:55] really kind of, you know, move in that direction where [00:10:00] I could really, you know, use them to kind of be the best person [00:10:05] or have the best career and be happy and fulfilled.

Speaker1: So I was almost thinking like this, [00:10:10] um, around that time and, you know, it transitioned from, I don’t want to do [00:10:15] medicine to, you know, what about optometry or pharmacy as as typical Asian parents [00:10:20] might think at the time. And then, um, and then I said, well, do you know what? Well, [00:10:25] what about dentistry? And I knew of two girls that I knew from, from Kenya who were in [00:10:30] their fourth year of dentistry. And I thought, well, that would be a fantastic career. And I [00:10:35] looked into it a little bit more work shadowed at the dentists on the high street. And I remember, [00:10:40] you know, going to my parents well, right. I’ve decided I want to do dentistry. And I remember [00:10:45] that they said, well, it’s really difficult. Do you think you’re going to be able to do it? [00:10:50] It’s a really it’s a really hard degree, like almost like they didn’t believe that I [00:10:55] was smart enough, um, to do dentistry, but I stuck by it. [00:11:00] I changed my Ucas form right at, you know, at the last minute. And [00:11:05] I’m really proud. I’ve never regretted it in my life. And I’m really proud because I’m so passionate about [00:11:10] dentistry.

Speaker3: What did you change it from? What were you doing just before dentistry?

Speaker1: It was like [00:11:15] a business.

Speaker3: Things.

Speaker1: Business studies and business management, that type of degree. And then you know [00:11:20] that that initial phase of of choosing. But there was so much confusion and I’m glad [00:11:25] that I self reflected, understood what my strengths were, and then [00:11:30] made a decision based on that.

Speaker3: And then you studied in Manchester?

Speaker1: I did, [00:11:35] I went to the University of Manchester. And which was [00:11:40] absolutely brilliant. And it’s such a great mix of a city and a campus university [00:11:45] and made some fantastic friends. And we were such a small cohort. And I think [00:11:50] that that made a huge difference, um, where being a small cohort, each [00:11:55] of us had the opportunity to shine in our own way. And that was fantastic [00:12:00] for confidence building. But not only that, we had a lot of attention, you know, [00:12:05] from our tutors, it was also a problem based learning at the time. I remember that it was a new [00:12:10] system that they had introduced. Um, and I’d obviously come from the International Baccalaureate, [00:12:15] um, sixth form. So I was used to kind of going and a lot [00:12:20] of self-study and understanding, well, this is a problem and how do we solve it? And I thought [00:12:25] that it’s just a nice way to transition from International Baccalaureate to problem [00:12:30] based learning was the system I understood. But again, looking back like what fantastic [00:12:35] life skills that gives you as well that this is a problem, let’s analyse it. And now [00:12:40] let’s treatment plan or let’s just plan what the outcome has to be, or strategize [00:12:45] how we need to go from here. So not only did that really help when I, [00:12:50] um, started working as a dentist, but it also helped in life in general.

Speaker3: What [00:12:55] were you like in Manchester?

Speaker1: Oh, you’re gonna have to. I can’t give you all my secrets. [00:13:00] Um. Come on. But, um, you know, the two [00:13:05] years of independence from being at boarding school, I. I had the confidence, um, [00:13:10] I came in, and I was just ready to live life. I think I’m a [00:13:15] work hard, party hard girl, and I don’t think that’s ever died. I think that’s still there. That’s [00:13:20] the way you have to live life, you know? Um, make every moment count. [00:13:25] Uh, so, um, loved my social life at Manchester. Um, loved [00:13:30] to go out. But at the same time, I really, really enjoyed my [00:13:35] course. I enjoyed all the biological aspects of all of it, that biology side [00:13:40] and the first two years. And then I was so excited to get into the clinical years as well. So [00:13:45] it was almost like.

Speaker3: It’s not a common story. Uh, it’s [00:13:50] like it’s a lot of people are overwhelmed by the course.

Speaker1: Do you know what? [00:13:55]

Speaker3: Do you not feel that? Um.

Speaker1: I wouldn’t say overwhelmed because I think that, [00:14:00] you know, I’d been in a really competitive school, you know, until GCSEs. Then [00:14:05] I went into another competitive school on, on my own. So I guess in that sense, I wasn’t [00:14:10] overwhelmed. You know, I’d left home already. I’d already started to experience that. So [00:14:15] for me, it was. Yes, it’s another challenge. Um, bring it on. And yes, [00:14:20] you know what? Plus plus that Kenyan upbringing.

Speaker3: Right. That Kenyan upbringing [00:14:25] is like gold. I mean, when I think about the number of people who’ve sat here in front of us, I mean, [00:14:30] Prav your family as well, right? But from East Africa. Yeah. Drew [00:14:35] Vishal Shah, my favourite, my favourite episode of them all, by the way. So many, so [00:14:40] many people. That Kenyan upbringing is different. It’s something about that Kenyan upbringing can do part [00:14:45] of it and the community part of it.

Speaker1: Yeah, absolutely. Um, I think community [00:14:50] friends, the environment that you’re growing up in is, I think very [00:14:55] different. And I think environment is not people that always impact you. It’s also the environment [00:15:00] as well. And I think that moulds you, that moulds your mindset and the experiences that you have moulds your mindset. [00:15:05]

Speaker4: Sarika, I’m curious about um, so you just spoke about like you go from [00:15:10] boarding school to uni and now you can let your hair down, right? And let’s call it freedom. [00:15:15] Let’s, let’s call the word freedom. Right. But you went from Kenya to Kent and from [00:15:20] Kenya to Kent. They must have been a degree of right I can let loose now. Right. [00:15:25] Because I’m not under my parents watch or whatever, or it’s different. Or [00:15:30] the other thing is that, you know, I don’t know what your life was like in Kenya, but I’m guessing because [00:15:35] your family could afford to send you to Kent, that you had a pretty good life in Kenya, right? That [00:15:40] everything was taken care of, things were done for you, etc., etc. then you moved to [00:15:45] Kent and now it’s, hey, I’ve got to fend for myself, right? I’ve got to grow up. And when [00:15:50] you said that, that sort of reminded me of me going to uni for the first time and having to do [00:15:55] my own thing, right. So you grew up a lot quicker than I did exactly [00:16:00] at the point in your life, if that makes sense, because we’re forced to do that, right? [00:16:05] Yeah. But then there was another level of growing up when you went to went to what was just just talk me [00:16:10] through, like what was going through your mind then at that point when you moved from Kenya [00:16:15] to Kent, maybe the difference in culture or whatever and the growing up you did, [00:16:20] but then what was holding you back in Kent that allowed you to let loose in Manchester? What [00:16:25] what what.

Speaker3: Being a teenager?

Speaker1: Well, this is it, right? I think that growing up in [00:16:30] Kenya, um, it was a privilege. Also a sheltered upbringing. [00:16:35] Right. And I think, again, being in a boarding school. Environment. You’re still [00:16:40] sheltered, right? Um, but really, when you go to university, [00:16:45] you’re truly independent. You’re truly independent. There are certain expectations. [00:16:50] They definitely were for me because I was an international student in terms of education [00:16:55] and grades. But at the same time, it was the time where I started [00:17:00] to think, well, this is my life now. I get to make the decisions. [00:17:05] I get to choose, uh, and I can, I will, I can, [00:17:10] I’ll probably make mistakes. I made a lot of mistakes. And I also had some [00:17:15] wonderful times and incredible memories. And I feel that what [00:17:20] happens is that from the age of from the time you’re born until you’re 20 and [00:17:25] is the time when you don’t, you know, you don’t have that. You’re not born with a sense of self that normally [00:17:30] starts from the age of 0 to 3, and then until the age of 20 is when people. [00:17:35] So the people closest to you can influence and [00:17:40] impact the way you are and the way you think and the decisions you make from [00:17:45] the age of 20 onwards is when you start [00:17:50] to take control of your life, or can decide if you want to start taking control of your, you know you’re [00:17:55] under, you’re less under the influence of other people. And that’s when you start to [00:18:00] truly become independent. That’s when you start to take more responsibilities. [00:18:05] That’s when you have to start taking accountability for your actions. And [00:18:10] that’s when you know you really have the power of choice. It’s in your hands [00:18:15] on how you dictate your life and where you want to go from there.

Speaker3: Take us through the professional journey [00:18:20] after that. So you qualified. Where did you work first and then when did you get [00:18:25] into the idea of, you know, private dentistry okay. Quality.

Speaker1: So what a story here, [00:18:30] right. So I was an international student and that meant that [00:18:35] I really, really had to fight for a job. And at this time I didn’t want to go back to Kenya. [00:18:40] I wanted to stay in the UK and get my experience. So I don’t know if you remember Payman, [00:18:45] but at the time it was all it was about job shops, right? The country was was all split up into [00:18:50] deaneries and and every deanery had a job shop. So all the trainers would come [00:18:55] to this job shop and it was an opportunity for you to meet them. They might do a little mini interview at the [00:19:00] time, and I think I applied to every single deanery. And [00:19:05] I remember like printing all these CVS and cover letters, um, [00:19:10] for, oh my gosh, I think I applied to over 100, 120 jobs [00:19:15] at the time. And this is two months before my final exams. Right? And I remember [00:19:20] gallivanting around the country trying to go for interviews, and it was really [00:19:25] it was so chaotic. It was it was the first time I think I really felt stressed because, [00:19:30] you know, passing your exams is one thing. Uh, it’s kind of in my control. [00:19:35] But getting a job was partially in my control. And, and at the time, I think it’s a lot [00:19:40] fairer. I think the system now is, is a lot fairer. But at the time, you know, trainers, they [00:19:45] kind of already knew in their mind who they wanted, but they almost had to like interview people [00:19:50] just to show they were interviewing people.

Speaker1: Um, I remember going for, you know, travelling [00:19:55] from Manchester all the way down to the, to the, to the south coast. And it took me eight [00:20:00] hours. Um, and it cost, it cost me money. I only had a budget like a strict budget [00:20:05] then spent. So it cost me money going all the way down there. But wow, what a life lesson. [00:20:10] And I basically just ended up in East Anglia. Um, I was at the job [00:20:15] shop then, uh, tired because I was wearing like five inch heels, [00:20:20] which I was known for at the time, and I just took a rest and I thought, okay, I’m just going to go [00:20:25] to the bar and have a drink. And there was a man there having a beer, and we just [00:20:30] started talking and he said, well, yeah, I’m actually, um, a partner of a practice, [00:20:35] um, in Norwich, and I’m looking for a VC. [00:20:40] And we ended up just chatting, connecting, and he invited me to come and have a look at [00:20:45] the practice a few days later. And that was it. We signed, uh, the what was it, the [00:20:50] letter of intent at the time in a pub. And that’s how it happened. That’s how I [00:20:55] got my job.

Speaker3: Why was it more difficult for a foreign student [00:21:00] to get a job? Was it just a I mean, yeah, you feel like [00:21:05] that people thought that you can’t do the communication piece as well?

Speaker1: No. Um, [00:21:10] at the time, the rule was that the priority has to go to, uh, UK [00:21:15] born citizen.

Speaker3: Right? Oh I see, yes yes yes yes yes.

Speaker1: So we weren’t prioritised.

Speaker3: Okay. [00:21:20] So then that practice was mixed or what must be.

Speaker1: So it [00:21:25] was it was mostly an NHS practice. Um, it was um, it was [00:21:30] a group of practices that was owned by four partners, and there was a primary [00:21:35] partner and then three other partners, and they had 13 practices in and around Norwich. [00:21:40] Wow. Yeah. And then that transition. So it was all NHS. And then [00:21:45] what they did was they opened up later on. I think I was there for seven years by the way. [00:21:50] Um, but probably later on when I was kind of done my four years, they’d [00:21:55] opened up a few private practices, which I then had the opportunity to work in because I was doing my Masters [00:22:00] in restorative at the same time. So they allowed me to work in their private practice as well, which was great experience. [00:22:05]

Speaker3: So I can imagine the clinical lessons you were learning at these [00:22:10] times. Because, you know, the early days, we all go through those, you know, slow and then speed up, [00:22:15] make some mistakes, can’t talk all the things that people people suffer. But what about [00:22:20] the sort of business lessons you learned there? Because there must have been a load.

Speaker1: Yeah, absolutely. [00:22:25] So do you know what let’s let’s talk about, [00:22:30] you know, business and finance because everyone. It’s something you hear so [00:22:35] commonly that we’re taught how to be dentists and be good clinically, [00:22:40] but we’re not actually taught the business or the finance skills at university. Right? [00:22:45] Um, so. When I came into, [00:22:50] you know, after I’d done my bit and I was an associate again, it was like being at the [00:22:55] deep end when it came to business and understanding hourly rate. I remember [00:23:00] that was the first time that, uh, my trainer, who was then mentoring me as well, [00:23:05] spoke about, okay, you’ve got to start thinking of your hourly rates and, you know, you’ve got to start, [00:23:10] you know, you’ve got to hire an accountant. And it’s suddenly about taxes and, you [00:23:15] know, savings and pension fund and, and all these things that I’d never heard of before. [00:23:20] And. I think that the dialogue [00:23:25] that I’d had in my head until then was that this is really overwhelming, [00:23:30] because I’m not good with money. Okay. And if I look at my [00:23:35] relationship with money prior to that is that I had actually grown up in [00:23:40] a household where my father was a primary earner. [00:23:45] And he managed most of the money in the family. [00:23:50] So talking and discussing about managing money was never really [00:23:55] done when I was young. And then when I left for boarding school, I remember [00:24:00] him, you know, they were dropping me off and they said, oh gosh, we need to open a bank account for you. Remember [00:24:05] walking into HSBC and them opening a bank account, giving me a bank card? And again, it was like almost [00:24:10] given to me.

Speaker1: And here are some cheques. You just need to, you know, deposit a check every [00:24:15] month and that’s your budget. And again, you know, and I don’t think it was their intention, [00:24:20] um, not to teach me this, but it was almost like I [00:24:25] had to learn about managing money on my own. So [00:24:30] in terms of business skills, at the practice that I worked in, I got [00:24:35] to see how multiple practices were being run. I got [00:24:40] to see how staff were being managed, and I got to see how [00:24:45] budgets were used. Um, in terms of buying stock and, you know, how [00:24:50] equipment was managed because a lot of us dentists, we were working in 2 or 3 different practices [00:24:55] within the group. So we were carrying all our equipment. And we also had like a little tool [00:25:00] kit in case something broke down. We were given training on how to fix, you know, the little [00:25:05] thing here or there. Yeah, it was fantastic. Um, and I’ll never forget that because [00:25:10] I remember then transitioning to become an associate. And if something broke down, I wouldn’t [00:25:15] be like, oh my gosh, help me. I don’t know what’s going on here. I’d almost want to, you know, [00:25:20] try to figure out what was happening, um, and try to fix it myself if I could, [00:25:25] you know, at the time. So. I think that in terms of business [00:25:30] skills, I learned quite a few things. On reflection.

Speaker4: Sarika. [00:25:35] A lot of, um, a lot of, shall we say, associate associates [00:25:40] approached me and say, hey, Prav, I want to open my own practice now. Yeah. [00:25:45] And there’s two main reasons that they cite, and it’s really interesting that they say that [00:25:50] you’ll be able to speak from the lens of a practice owner now, but they say I’m giving away [00:25:55] 55% of my income to the practice. Right? [00:26:00] I want to keep 100% of my income. So reason one why they want to open a practice, [00:26:05] right? And reason two, which comes up a lot, is the patient journey [00:26:10] is not how I would like to treat patients. They do this wrong, [00:26:15] they do this wrong. And and I’m restricted with respect to how I can treat the patient [00:26:20] or what the journey is. And they want to create this new journey for the patient and [00:26:25] from a, from a blank canvas. And so practice ownership becomes the only thing [00:26:30] to do. Yeah. Out of curiosity in that experience, in your associate experience, [00:26:35] was there anything patient journey related where you thought, do you know what I want [00:26:40] to do this different? And what were those things?

Speaker1: Absolutely. I [00:26:45] think everyone has different experiences when they work as an associates. And [00:26:50] you come at some point, you come to this realisation of what [00:26:55] kind of dentist do you want to want to be? And I think it starts off from there. [00:27:00] Okay. What kind of dentist do you want to be? And I think that’s really powerful, by the way, [00:27:05] when someone does get to that point, and when I was working [00:27:10] as an associate, there were so many things that I saw in terms of management, [00:27:15] in terms of patient journey, in terms of the care that I wanted to give patients. Right. [00:27:20] And and that, you know, Interlinks with the type of clinical dentistry that I was doing as [00:27:25] well. But you’re so naive at that time because you don’t actually you’re [00:27:30] not actually managing your staff. You’re not actually paying for things. You don’t actually [00:27:35] know the costs of things right at the time. You have all these hopes and dreams [00:27:40] and desires and you think, well, okay, in order to get from A to B and really [00:27:45] kind of practice the dentistry, I want to practice and give that patient journey and the patient care that I [00:27:50] want to give, the only way forward is to open a practice. But [00:27:55] then the hard lessons are in front of you, and they’re the challenges that you then have to face [00:28:00] that it’s not it’s not that easy. It’s not that easy to develop [00:28:05] a patient journey that’s flawless. It’s not that easy to give 100% patient care every [00:28:10] single time because the entire team is involved, not just you, and you have to manage everyone [00:28:15] else around it. And then of course, things cost money. So if you want your patients [00:28:20] to experience a really good journey. And you know you want your staff to be happy. [00:28:25] Um, yes. You have to bring things like create the culture and the value. [00:28:30] Uh, you know, values and things like that, which I’m very pro, by the way, and I love doing with [00:28:35] my team. But at the same time, it costs money. It takes time. [00:28:40] And, you know, it’s it’s a big learning curve, a steep learning curve.

Speaker4: And [00:28:45] so what part specifically of the patient journey during your [00:28:50] time as a say a non principal or non practice owner. [00:28:55] Were you passionate about that you wanted to change. Do you know what that [00:29:00] weren’t right. And have you put them right now or have you struck. It sounds like you’ve [00:29:05] struggled to put them right as everyone does because we paint this ideal of what it should be. But then [00:29:10] the reality kicks in of team management and all the rest of it. You’ve alluded to [00:29:15] but but what specifically? I’m really curious about that, because the dentist who I speak to have [00:29:20] different ideals and they’re not always the same. So I’m just wondering what yours yours were.

Speaker1: Yeah, [00:29:25] absolutely. And to be honest with you, it was part of my business plan was to have [00:29:30] that that full flow from beginning to end of the patient journey. [00:29:35] And I think that when there is a break in that, then that’s when [00:29:40] it starts to affect patient journey and patient care. So what I realised, my experience is working as an associate, [00:29:45] was that often receptionists would pick up the phone and adhere their, their tone [00:29:50] and the way they were speaking to patients wasn’t very welcoming. I would then do everything [00:29:55] I could bend over backwards to give them the best care, and sometimes then there wasn’t great [00:30:00] aftercare, you know? Again, phone call, check out, check in. You know, all [00:30:05] of that just wasn’t done the way I, I thought it should be done. And [00:30:10] so was actually part of my business plan is patient journey and patient care is is at the core [00:30:15] of everything that I want my practice to be about. Um, and therefore everyone [00:30:20] is trained on that from day dot. Right. And there is continuous [00:30:25] training on that as we move forward. It’s always something that we talk about. It’s always [00:30:30] something that we prioritise as almost being the USP [00:30:35] in our practice as well. And honestly, our practice has grown organically. [00:30:40]

Speaker1: You know, we’ve hardly had to do huge amounts of marketing and marketing, um, huge [00:30:45] amounts of advertisement. And it’s down to building our reputation, you know, it’s just [00:30:50] down to trying to understand what is it that patients want, what is it they need? And incorporating it in the patient [00:30:55] journey. People think patient journey is just a line from A to B. It’s not. It’s so [00:31:00] much more complex than that. There’s so much more that you have to add along the way. So [00:31:05] then and then you have to refine everything as you’re going along the way, right? And you have to [00:31:10] almost be accountable for everything, um, along the way as well. And then do that constant training. So [00:31:15] not only is it being sustained, you’re getting better and better and better [00:31:20] at it. Right. Um, and it’s again down to systems and processes in the practice. [00:31:25] It’s um, it’s down to having, uh, certain standards. So standardising [00:31:30] that if someone came to see me and I give them a particular [00:31:35] service, if they went to see one of my associates, they’re getting exactly the same service. It’s not like I went to see the principal [00:31:40] of the practice. It’s like I went to see someone at this practice, and it was an incredible. [00:31:45]

Speaker4: And then at what point did Rishi come in? At what point did. Because [00:31:50] Rishi, for those who don’t know, Rishi is your your your husband and your, shall [00:31:55] we say, business partner, but he runs the business with you and um. Yeah, I’ve had the I’ve had the privilege [00:32:00] of obviously working with you guys and having lengthy conversations both with Rishi and yourself. [00:32:05] And I think certainly for me, that the more successful [00:32:10] practices that I work with are those that have family involved, right? [00:32:15] It can also cause problems as well. I’ve seen I’ve seen that too. Right. But actually having [00:32:20] that person on board that you can give 100% trust to and you’ve both got the same [00:32:25] vision. So tell us about when Rishi came into your life. Um, and then [00:32:30] how that evolved in, in the, in the practice. Did you, did you buy it together? [00:32:35] Did he come along later? What was the chronology of all of that? And what does Rishi do in [00:32:40] the practice? Sure.

Speaker1: So when I was an associate and I was reflecting back and I [00:32:45] wanted to buy the practice that that seed was planted, okay, I knew that I wanted to go in a different direction. [00:32:50] My brother, who’s five years younger than me, was also a dentist, and [00:32:55] I remember having a conversation. He said, look, you know, we’re both dentists. It only makes sense that we do this together. [00:33:00] My brother lived in Manchester at the time, okay, and we lived in London, [00:33:05] so there was obviously that distance and we started the journey. We started looking at practices [00:33:10] and Rishi was very much involved in looking at the financial [00:33:15] side because that’s Rishi’s background. Okay. He was in finance. He was still working in finance [00:33:20] at the time. So we kind of leveraged his, you know, on his knowledge and [00:33:25] his skills. Um, and, you know, we just thought, well, here he can contribute really well here. And [00:33:30] we learned things along the way as well. Um, you know, about some of the profitability, finances, [00:33:35] you know, accounts in that side of things. And in the end, it didn’t work out with my brother because they [00:33:40] decided to stay in the Midlands. Um, and then so, you [00:33:45] know, I said, well, I still want to go down this route. Are you happy to help me? And she said, yeah, absolutely. So we were still looking [00:33:50] at practices and then he started getting more and more interested in it. And, [00:33:55] and then he said to me, do you know, one day he said, darling, would it be [00:34:00] okay if we if we did this together? Um, and you know, we’ve got, we’ve [00:34:05] got fantastic.

Speaker1: You know, we’ve got skills on, on either end. You’ve got you can be the kind of clinical [00:34:10] director in that side of it and take control of that. And I can help with the whole, um, [00:34:15] you know, financial side of it, the marketing, um, you know, and, [00:34:20] you know, also help with like, management of staff and, but take over the entire [00:34:25] finance side of it. And it just worked out really well because we’ve got completely different [00:34:30] skill sets. But there are two strong skill sets that you need to run [00:34:35] a practice really efficiently. And yeah, we [00:34:40] started our journey. So basically when we bought the practice where she was still working in banking, [00:34:45] um, we wanted to kind of we’d invested a lot of money, we’d taken a lot of risk. [00:34:50] Um, and just a few years prior, we’d bought our first property as well. So, um, [00:34:55] he just said that. Look, until the finances, you know, work out, personal finances work out, I’ll [00:35:00] continue to work. So he was working two jobs, I remember, you know, working very late at night, [00:35:05] both of us, you know, um, so the first few years were really tough, and then he transitioned [00:35:10] into working full time. And yeah, we’re we’re a 5050 partnership in the practice.

Speaker3: Tell [00:35:15] us the the steps you went through to actually conceive the practice. I mean, were you thinking [00:35:20] squat? Were you thinking buyer practice? Were both things in your head? And [00:35:25] then something shifted you one way or the other?

Speaker1: Yeah, absolutely. Um, it was, it was looking [00:35:30] at both. And I think you have to look at both options. Uh, it’s just about the opportunity [00:35:35] that came our way. I mean, Payman, you’ve been to our practice, right? Like, what’s not to love [00:35:40] about that building? It is just we. I just fell in love with it. [00:35:45]

Speaker3: Was it existing or did you was existing. Did you start it yourself? You started yourself? No, [00:35:50] I was existing practice.

Speaker1: Yeah, but it was a very small, slow two surgery practice [00:35:55] and we just saw opportunity. I mean, she’s I remember him coming home and saying [00:36:00] I’ve found this fancy practice and you’re going to love it. I know you’re going to love it. And [00:36:05] you know, we both just fell in love with it. Him because of the financial [00:36:10] possibility of what he could achieve from that side. And, and for me, about [00:36:15] what I could create and what I could do and the building and the vibe and the energy [00:36:20] and all of that, like, you know, was was just so in sync with who I was. So [00:36:25] it was a great synergy.

Speaker3: Were you sure it was going to be in Docklands? Did you know that already before? [00:36:30] You know, was that the only place you were looking?

Speaker1: No, not at all. And it was we were living literally on the other side of the river, [00:36:35] so we can see the building from our where we lived in our apartment and where we lived. But absolutely [00:36:40] not. I think when you’re when you’re looking for a practice, you’ve got to explore [00:36:45] all options. You’ve. Go to explore squat practice. You’ve got to explore [00:36:50] an existing practice. And you know, of course, you [00:36:55] know, we wanted it to be, you know, somewhere that was close ish for us to get to because [00:37:00] we know that we have to spend a lot of time there. So that was important. Um, but at the same [00:37:05] time, we were willing to move for the right practice as well. You know, we were we didn’t we didn’t have any children at the time. [00:37:10] So in that sense, we had the flexibility. But it was about the [00:37:15] right practice. And I think it’s a really important, um, that [00:37:20] you know exactly what you want and then you take your time [00:37:25] to look for it if you’re going to invest in something like that.

Speaker3: So [00:37:30] what what were your you know, we’ve got lots of moving parts when you buy a practice. Right. Should it be, [00:37:35] you know, leasehold, freehold. How big how many people potential for for growth. [00:37:40] What what what were your sort of red lines. What were you saying. Were you saying I definitely want a place that [00:37:45] I can do up and grow, or were you saying it has to be fully [00:37:50] private or what were the what were the parameters that you were looking in?

Speaker1: Yeah, absolutely. [00:37:55] And I think it’s important that you have parameters. Right. So again, really understanding what you [00:38:00] want. So definitely at the time I the type of dentistry I was doing, I was already [00:38:05] working in, you know, a private practice and I wanted it to be fully private. And it was an [00:38:10] existing private practice that we bought in terms of leasehold freehold to us. We were [00:38:15] exploring all options, but we definitely wanted a site where we [00:38:20] could grow in. So in terms of the the layout and the space and looking [00:38:25] at that, I mean, this was AA2 surgery practice that turned into a very vibrant and busy [00:38:30] four surgery practice. Right? So we were able to do that over two refurbishments. And [00:38:35] yeah, you always want the potential for growth.

Speaker3: So how many people was it when [00:38:40] you how many people was it when you bought it and how many people you know.

Speaker1: Gosh, there was seven people, [00:38:45] including everybody. And now we both are lead a team of [00:38:50] 25.

Speaker3: Wow. Since 2017.

Speaker1: Oh, it’s seven years. [00:38:55]

Speaker3: Oh excellent.

Speaker4: So when you when you bought the practice, [00:39:00] um, a lot of people say to me that, um, after buying the practice, they uncover some skeletons, [00:39:05] right, that they didn’t know about when they, when they signed on the dotted line. [00:39:10] And was there anything like that that came any kind of surprises or shocks during the early days where you [00:39:15] thought, oh, crap, I’ve got to deal with this now? And what were the what were the most challenging things [00:39:20] in the in the early days of, um, buying an existing practice? Okay.

Speaker1: So [00:39:25] I’d say the first thing that comes to memory is, is staff. Okay. You come [00:39:30] in with all these different ideas about how you want your team to be, but [00:39:35] you’re taking over an existing team that is run and managed very, very differently. So [00:39:40] you can bring in all your ideas and, you [00:39:45] know, and again, they’re they’ve been sat in a comfort zone. So you’re going to come in with all these different changes. [00:39:50] And some staff will be excited by that and some just won’t be. And I think you’ve got to be quite thick skinned [00:39:55] about that. Um, and you’ve got to start learning about recruitment [00:40:00] and how to recruit. So I’d say that was the number one challenge that [00:40:05] we faced when we first bought the practice. And then the second thing was probably [00:40:10] just structural, structural things like in terms of, you know, when you it’s like going to buy [00:40:15] a house, right? It’s exactly the same thing. You get like a really short opportunity to go in [00:40:20] and, and, and see, it’s not like a test drive that you get to like work in it or live in [00:40:25] it. I mean, some people, you know, may have the privilege to do that, but, you know, we just had a quick, you know, look [00:40:30] at the practice and and then that was it.

Speaker1: Make a decision because there’s [00:40:35] people competing, you know, against this in this buying process. So we had to be quite quick. [00:40:40] Um, so structurally for sure, I remember our deacon room and how everything [00:40:45] was just literally breaking down. And I was thinking, oh my goodness, how did we not see this when we when, [00:40:50] when when we walked around? How could we, you know, miss miss these things. But but that was [00:40:55] it, to be honest with you. And then it was just about clearing up and the mess [00:41:00] and, and you know, all the paperwork and the boxes and all this kind of stuff. And I’m [00:41:05] a very organised person. So thank God for that skill because, um, I spent many, [00:41:10] many Saturdays and Sundays, you know, with, with my marigolds on and, you know, like [00:41:15] going through all these boxes and, and, you know, going through all this mess. So [00:41:20] I think just be prepared potentially for that. But it depends on the type of practice you’re buying. Right. [00:41:25] Sure.

Speaker4: Of course. Um, sureka. Let’s let’s move on now [00:41:30] to, um, your journey today, which is very different from, well, obviously, [00:41:35] whatever, whatever you do in the past shapes your future. Right? But a [00:41:40] lot of the content that you seem to be putting out right now is, is more, um, inspirational, aspirational. [00:41:45] Motivational in terms of its, um, vibe and, [00:41:50] um, what sort of instigated that? What was the what was the driving force [00:41:55] behind that? And then, um, you know, I remember speaking to you a few [00:42:00] months ago and you said to me, Prav, you know what? I really want to do something [00:42:05] different for women in dentistry. I feel they’re underrepresented. [00:42:10] I feel that there’s so much more we can do [00:42:15] for them. And I want to help. So I want to put a course together to [00:42:20] help women in dentistry. So I think my first question is, what is it specifically [00:42:25] about women in dentistry that is is different and more more difficult, [00:42:30] should we say for you guys? And then what is it that drove that [00:42:35] motivation.

Speaker1: Yeah, absolutely. So look, I think since I’ve [00:42:40] graduated I’ve noticed a huge progression, right, in [00:42:45] dentistry, but not just on the clinical side of the profession, but in the industry as, [00:42:50] as a whole. Okay. And for most of my career so far, I’ve been really passionate about [00:42:55] dentistry. However, I think that I have definitely [00:43:00] faced obstacles and I’ve definitely faced challenges, um, in [00:43:05] my career so far. And it’s been on reflection of some of the barriers that [00:43:10] I face and that I’ve experienced. And then, you know, over the last, I’d say [00:43:15] 7 or 8 years, I’ve been having countless conversations with women in [00:43:20] dentistry, not just clinical side of dentistry, but also the industry side [00:43:25] of dentistry. And and I’ve started to notice that there’s a trend that [00:43:30] a lot of us are facing similar barriers, and maybe not all the ones that I’ve [00:43:35] experienced, but a lot of women are facing the same barriers. And I started to, you know, I started to discuss [00:43:40] it with my husband and my friends and other dentists. That why why are we not discussing this more? [00:43:45] Why is there not more kind of education around how women can [00:43:50] overcome barriers, um, in dentistry? And look, if you look at the statistics [00:43:55] of how things are now, you know, 50% or more of graduates are female, [00:44:00] right? So then I started to question, well, in this profession [00:44:05] that I love, what is the future of dentistry actually look like? Right. If many of us are are [00:44:10] facing barriers such as potentially lack of confidence or management of [00:44:15] time or our relationship with money and all these common, you know, these, these common [00:44:20] beliefs that we have, then what is the future of dentistry actually look like? Last [00:44:25] year I climbed Kilimanjaro, and part of that climb was for me to find [00:44:30] my purpose and to get clarity on my purpose. And I feel [00:44:35] like it’s almost like a mission for me now to really [00:44:40] reach out to women, inspire them, motivate them, and, [00:44:45] you know, for them to feel like they are extremely strong leaders in [00:44:50] the dental field.

Speaker4: Sarika, what are the most common barriers? You mentioned a [00:44:55] few barriers there, and a couple of them, um, you mentioned would be barriers that are, you know, [00:45:00] um, experienced by both men and women, right? So for example, relationship with money or finances [00:45:05] and things like that. So I want to dig into more specifically the sort of things [00:45:10] that, you know, women in dentistry have reached out to you about and maybe some of your own barriers that [00:45:15] you’ve faced. Um, as a female in dentistry, you know, whether it revolves [00:45:20] around being a wife, a mother and a business owner all at once and trying to manage [00:45:25] that juggle, that juggling act. What are some of the most common barriers [00:45:30] that you’ve heard about or experienced yourself? Sure.

Speaker1: So I think when I first [00:45:35] started off as a young dentist, um, in that practice that I worked in, it was a very male dominated [00:45:40] profession. And at the time, and on [00:45:45] a social level, I would say there was a lack of. And [00:45:50] socially what what what the practice did for other women. There was lots of social [00:45:55] events that were planned for men, but very little for women. So not not only [00:46:00] were the men kind of had the opportunity to connect, and the opportunities for women [00:46:05] to connect were only happening at work and not outside of work. And I also thought that [00:46:10] there was a lack of female to female support. I only [00:46:15] ever went to my, my, um, my male, um, dentist, [00:46:20] you know, dentist friends for help, for support and for mentorship, but very little. There was [00:46:25] very little female to female support. I also think, relatively speaking, that dentistry [00:46:30] is quite a daunting to career to work in, especially in the initial years. You’re [00:46:35] expected to competently work on your own from day one, and [00:46:40] not only is that challenging on so many levels, but it can be really isolating and [00:46:45] confidence. I think it’s important for us to talk about confidence, you know, two huge [00:46:50] qualities that are correlated in dentistry and in today’s world [00:46:55] are confidence and effective communication. So what [00:47:00] I realised with myself and countless conversations that I’ve had with women on this topic, [00:47:05] is that women often have the competence, but they don’t have the confidence [00:47:10] in many situations. And it’s almost the opposite for men sometimes [00:47:15] I think. But, but, but you know, when, when [00:47:20] and I mean that very respectfully.

Speaker1: But, um, when we talk about confidence [00:47:25] in particular, I think that there are two types of confidence that people have. And it’s important to talk about [00:47:30] this. There’s an outer confidence on how you behave in your environment [00:47:35] and rely on what other people think of us. And then there is an inner confidence [00:47:40] in how you accept and trust yourself and almost have a sense of control in [00:47:45] your life. So personally, I would say that for most of my life, [00:47:50] though I had portrayed outer confidence, I didn’t have much inner confidence. Uh, [00:47:55] and because of that, I suffered with a lot of stress, anxiety, imposter [00:48:00] thoughts, fear, self-judgment, and perfectionism. And [00:48:05] not just in relation to my clinical dentistry, but in other aspects of my life, too. So, [00:48:10] you know, we should identify that confidence or a lack of confidence. [00:48:15] It’s a very gender neutral concept, and everyone will be confident and not confident about [00:48:20] something. But and I think there’s a big debate around stereotyping that [00:48:25] outcomes and of decisions that women make are due to a lack of self confidence. [00:48:30] And I don’t think we should go into that because it’s more important to discuss why [00:48:35] some women suffer with a lack of confidence. And if I may continue, [00:48:40] I think in my opinion, this comes down to two things. So [00:48:45] the first is our environment and what we see as [00:48:50] women. We’ve grown up and we still live and work in quite a male dominated environment. [00:48:55] Yes, things are changing, but it’s definitely not happening at the magnitude and speed at which [00:49:00] we think it’s changing.

Speaker1: And, you know, we’ve started to see that shift in the last [00:49:05] few years in dentistry where women are not only showcasing incredible [00:49:10] clinical skills, but they’re more involved in teaching and lecturing. [00:49:15] They’re building and developing more businesses and clinics and [00:49:20] taking on bigger leadership roles. And I just want to maybe take this opportunity right now to acknowledge [00:49:25] and commend those serious female powerhouses that are out there, although worldwide, [00:49:30] we have noticed that, like I said, there’s that huge movement [00:49:35] in female empowerment, but the speed at which it’s happening is, is [00:49:40] not at what we think it is, especially because some of the choices [00:49:45] and opportunities that women have had have only really happened within the last hundred years or so, [00:49:50] many of which have happened in the last 50 years. So for the majority [00:49:55] of women in our life, we’ve been influenced by a male dominated world. You know, we’ve we’ve [00:50:00] lived in patriarchy for so long, and for those women that are already making it, they’ve had to [00:50:05] overcome some pretty big biases and challenges. And again, you know, just [00:50:10] to let you both know, this is a really common conversation, a topic of conversation, [00:50:15] um, amongst women. And I think the second reason behind a lack of self-confidence [00:50:20] sometimes is our upbringing to some degree, um, namely cultures and beliefs. [00:50:25] And I’d like to maybe discuss one aspect of this, and it’s called the [00:50:30] The Good Girl syndrome. Have either of you heard of this? The good girl syndrome? Yeah, yeah. [00:50:35] Um, be a.

Speaker3: Good girl and do the.

Speaker1: Exactly. Um, and, you know, [00:50:40] it’s often used in our childhood by our caregivers. So the good girl syndrome is basically just [00:50:45] the manifestation of traits valued and praised amongst little girls, [00:50:50] and how deviating from those traits makes them feel guilty or fearful of [00:50:55] being judged, constantly seeking validation from others and the need [00:51:00] to excel in everything that they do. So they’re setting themselves really, really high standards all the time [00:51:05] and almost being perfect. And this inability to say no, um, and [00:51:10] being afraid of upsetting others. So it’s no wonder, with this kind of conditioning, [00:51:15] that many women develop scripts, mindset, beliefs that [00:51:20] lead to them suffering with fear, self-doubt, impostor thoughts, perfectionism, [00:51:25] people pleasing um, and a lack of deep inner confidence. [00:51:30]

Speaker4: I’ve got a question. I’ve got a question related to that, which is, um, it relates [00:51:35] to children, actually, because, um, what you just brought up there is, is [00:51:40] be a be a good girl in that. So, so you actually it’s almost like [00:51:45] you get this definition of what being a good girl is, and then you don’t want to be a [00:51:50] bad girl. So you you behave in that certain way and you become conditioned, right? Absolutely. [00:51:55] But boy or girl with our with our children. Right. We can say things to [00:52:00] our kids, right? Oh, you’re a really good girl. You’re a good boy, you’re a good kid, blah blah, [00:52:05] blah, blah, blah. And unknowingly, we could be conditioning them into [00:52:10] what is good or bad. And on the whole, I believe we should teach our teach [00:52:15] our kids, um, you know, how to behave and set examples for them and stuff. But [00:52:20] has that impacted the way you, you interact with, with your kids and what you say and how you communicate [00:52:25] with them? Our curiosity.

Speaker1: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that [00:52:30] you’re right. We we use we use that phrase quite a bit. Right. Like be a good boy [00:52:35] and do this. Or if you’re not going to be a good boy, you’re going to be naughty. You won’t get that. But yeah, [00:52:40] you know, we’ve got to be careful on how we use that phrase. I think it’s [00:52:45] really important. And I think modern parenting, there is a bit more awareness around [00:52:50] how we use that phrase, uh, phrase. Because, you know, we recognise that, [00:52:55] especially me as a woman. I feel that I’ve recognised through my upbringing how much it’s affected [00:53:00] me. And I have memories of, you know, being the older sibling as well that, [00:53:05] you know, I’d be playing with, with with my with my brother. Um, he’s [00:53:10] trying to snatch a toy from me. And this happens over and over again. He’s trying to snatch a toy from me. And my parents would say, [00:53:15] do you know what? I’ll give it to your brother. You’re such a good girl, you know? And everything was. You’re such a good girl. You’re [00:53:20] such a good girl. And for such a long time, you know, we I had that fear [00:53:25] of judgement from people, you know, for so long.

Speaker1: And it’s crazy how powerful that is, because [00:53:30] it really stops you from moving forward and achieving [00:53:35] goals, or trying something new and taking on a new challenge and also constantly [00:53:40] seeking validation. You know, it was it was only, you know. I’d say maybe ten years [00:53:45] ago, where I looked at myself and I thought, gosh, I’m so proud of myself for [00:53:50] achieving what I’ve achieved because I’ve been through a lot. And, you know, I don’t talk about enough. But how [00:53:55] often do we say that we’re proud of ourselves and what we’ve achieved? Right. And I [00:54:00] think we came from a generation where parents didn’t necessarily tell you that. And I think, [00:54:05] I think my parents told me that, you know, they were proud of me for me just a few years ago. You [00:54:10] know, they look back at my life. I was so proud of you. And I’m like, thanks. I’ve never heard you say that before. [00:54:15] And again, not intentionally right. But I think that culturally it [00:54:20] wasn’t just we weren’t given, you know, that that validation.

Speaker3: So does your [00:54:25] course cover this aspect as well?

Speaker1: Absolutely. Okay. So I guess [00:54:30] let’s talk about the course okay. The course is around self leadership [00:54:35] for for women in dentistry. And I think that there is a difference [00:54:40] between leadership and self leadership. And we should understand what that what that difference is. [00:54:45] And I’d like to bring some clarity around that. So leadership is defined as the ability [00:54:50] to lead other people. So there’s an external motivation. However [00:54:55] the more common leadership training um that will [00:55:00] teach elements of self leadership like having certain thoughts, behaviours and attributes. So [00:55:05] if you both visualise a beautiful tree, we’ll call it the leadership [00:55:10] tree. And this tree has roots, a tree trunk and branches. The [00:55:15] self leadership is the roots and the skills of self. Leadership is the roots. The [00:55:20] trunk is is macro or external leadership skills and [00:55:25] the branches are the different types of leadership roles and styles. So [00:55:30] self leadership the rules, the roots, sorry [00:55:35] is the fundamental base of any leadership. It’s [00:55:40] having a true sense of who you really are, the potential of what you can [00:55:45] do. So the power of choice and have full clarity on your goals [00:55:50] where you’re going, coupled with the ability to be able to intentionally [00:55:55] with full control influence your thinking, your feelings, and your actions on the way to getting there. [00:56:00] So with Self-leadership skills, you’re able to successfully [00:56:05] navigate, thrive, and succeed through life’s challenges. Master [00:56:10] self-awareness. Self-confidence. Self-management. Make time work for you. [00:56:15] Decrease stress and overwhelm. Be resilient in the face of adversity. [00:56:20] Find meaning and purpose in your greater.

Speaker1: Why. Understand [00:56:25] from your individual strengths and how to leverage them. Experience [00:56:30] better relationships with others around you, at home and at work, and [00:56:35] beginning to live life with real intentionality and literally [00:56:40] be the most authentic version of yourself every single day. So [00:56:45] by practising and mastering self-leadership, you’re developing [00:56:50] your your inner game, okay? And your inner game consists of your mindset, which is intention, [00:56:55] self-awareness like your authenticity, self-confidence, self-belief, self-management, [00:57:00] which is self-motivation. And then with this and having more clarity around [00:57:05] it, your choices and decisions, you positively influence your outer game and [00:57:10] that’s your actions. So I believe that self leadership, through [00:57:15] my own experience, is the foundation for being an effective human [00:57:20] in the current contemporary world that that we live in. And [00:57:25] once you understand that, you can start to master your macro external leadership [00:57:30] skills and then move on to more niche leadership styles. So [00:57:35] a lot of people ask me that, you know, does does self leadership mean that [00:57:40] you’re going to suddenly transition in this world? Um, and [00:57:45] it’s not necessarily that. Um, so being a self leader doesn’t, [00:57:50] you know, doesn’t mean that you have to be a leader in the traditional traditional sense. Right? Not [00:57:55] everyone wants to lead. So the world needs both leaders and followers. And [00:58:00] I guess I truly believe that if you can’t effectively lead others [00:58:05] in any aspect of your life, then you [00:58:10] know you can’t effectively lead others in any aspect of your life if you can’t lead yourself first. And [00:58:15] that’s so important.

Speaker3: But the you know, it’s a bit like [00:58:20] asking, um, how do I lose weight? Well, you go to the gym and you eat good [00:58:25] food. The information, but the execution on it, [00:58:30] the mindset it takes to turn up for yourself. I find [00:58:35] that the real challenge because I’ll turn up for others. But for yourself, what’s [00:58:40] the what’s a hack you can use to take care of that?

Speaker1: So look, [00:58:45] mindset and mindset shift, which is a huge part of self leadership. You’ve [00:58:50] got to be able to understand that because a lot of what the habits that are already set in us [00:58:55] is from experience and from from, from previous beliefs. Right. And [00:59:00] the good thing is the brain is mouldable and that there are strategies on [00:59:05] how you can change that mindset and make that shift. But look, [00:59:10] I mean payment, you have to realise that you want the change first, right? [00:59:15] You have to realise, you know, where is it you want to go, what kind of life [00:59:20] do you really want to live? Right? And once you have that set [00:59:25] in stone, then you’re ready to then use all the strategies, um, from [00:59:30] self leadership, create that mindset change. And then it’s all about intentionality, [00:59:35] accountability, responsibility. And then moving on from there.

Speaker3: I know, but [00:59:40] I want to live a skinny life. That’s the life. Change. [00:59:45] It’s lovely. It’s lovely.

Speaker1: You know, I’ve been through that myself, you know, [00:59:50] I’m.

Speaker3: Sure you, you.

Speaker1: Know, and you know, I feel like I’m very age positive. [00:59:55] And I feel I’m in my 40s now, and I’m probably in terms of my fitness, [01:00:00] um, and my ability, my energy. I’m the best that I’ve been possibly [01:00:05] ever in my life. Really? Absolutely. And again, it was just down [01:00:10] to, first of all, understanding, why do I why do I want to change? [01:00:15] Why do I want to lose weight? Why do I want to be in this state of energy and and creating [01:00:20] that why? And then having a system put in place in terms of your diet [01:00:25] and your exercise and making them non-negotiables right in our life. And I think [01:00:30] Rishi and I have created such a great balance in our lives. And even when it comes to time management [01:00:35] for our business, what we do and our son, we’ve made all [01:00:40] our exercise in our health a non-negotiable. So it’s totally possible [01:00:45] to like that.

Speaker3: Let’s finish with the darker side. [01:00:50] When we on this pod, we like to look at errors. Mistakes in the hope that [01:00:55] we can all learn from them. When I when I say clinical mistakes, [01:01:00] what comes to mind?

Speaker1: Gosh. One one [01:01:05] dark, dark memory. So. At university, [01:01:10] we didn’t have a lot of clinical experience with molar endo. And [01:01:15] so I think I just done one more llorando when I graduated. Right. [01:01:20] And then in my VCE, that’s it. You’re you’re working in NHS practice. [01:01:25] You have to face it. Everything that comes in, you’re responsible for every single person [01:01:30] that comes through that door. And I remember seeing this molar endo that [01:01:35] that I had to do was really nervous about it. I was going through all my notes again. I was talking to, you [01:01:40] know, my friends, mentors, and basically I had [01:01:45] over extruded in, in all all the canals. And the smaller [01:01:50] endo had failed about a year on and another dentist [01:01:55] then took it out. I had the tooth had to be extracted, so extracted it and [01:02:00] you could see the little bit of GP at the end of the roots. And I remember a [01:02:05] nurse going around and having this tooth on the tissue and showing it to everyone and saying, look, [01:02:10] Sarika did this endo, you know, um, and that was a devastating. [01:02:15]

Speaker3: How did that happen?

Speaker1: Devastating for me.

Speaker3: How did that happen that [01:02:20] last piece.

Speaker1: Yeah. Gosh I mean this is it. Right. And [01:02:25] she was she was my nurse. She was my nurse in my PT. And you know, something I haven’t spoken about today was, [01:02:30] um, that I was bullied by her in, in my year, um, [01:02:35] and kind of had to face that challenge as well. So. It was just one of those [01:02:40] things. And I think you just have to know that as a dentist, [01:02:45] you have a huge responsibility, right? You’re building your experience with time, and you [01:02:50] have to be patient and kind to yourself. Um, as you progress through your career, you [01:02:55] have to own your mistakes and, you know, reflect on them, learn from [01:03:00] them, and just be better. Be better every single day. But, [01:03:05] you know, all of us know that it’s it’s experience comes with time. You’re always going to [01:03:10] have challenges, all different types of challenges, but it’s about facing them. And then, [01:03:15] you know, being able to make the right decisions and make the right choices [01:03:20] and then move on from there.

Speaker3: What about if we were to push the rewind button [01:03:25] on platinum? Back to the day you started. Now, knowing [01:03:30] what you know now, what different decisions would you make?

Speaker1: Gosh. [01:03:35] Um.

Speaker3: Would you do something earlier [01:03:40] or.

Speaker1: Do you know what? No. Because, um, that triggered you [01:03:45] won’t believe it. But that moment actually triggered my decision [01:03:50] to then do my mjff and then do my MSC in restorative [01:03:55] Easemon. I just, I told myself, and I don’t know, you know, I [01:04:00] guess that with every challenge we talk about resilience. With [01:04:05] that challenge, there’s there’s trauma attached to it. Right. And we’re not good about talking about that trauma. [01:04:10] So you can you know, a lot of people kind of react to that trauma. And I guess that [01:04:15] that was my reaction to the trauma. And I told myself that I wanted to be the best. [01:04:20] I would never let this ever, ever, ever happen again. I would take 100% responsibility. [01:04:25] And for every single treatment that came my way, I would just make sure that [01:04:30] I’d done my best. And if it was out of my skill set, I’m not going to be scared [01:04:35] about asking for help anymore. I’m not going to be scared just to kind of hit the [01:04:40] pause button and just be like, you know what? This is out of my skill set, and I just [01:04:45] need to think about this a little bit more. And what it did was it just took a bit [01:04:50] of bit of fear away. It really it was like a bit of a punch in the face, to be honest with you. [01:04:55] And it took a bit of the fear away, but it had a really positive impact.

Speaker3: Often [01:05:00] look at. Often the worst thing that happens to you in your life is ends up being the best [01:05:05] thing because of forms you, doesn’t it? That it changes changes who [01:05:10] you are. And you know when there’s a whole podcast called How to Fail. [01:05:15] It’s where they come in with their three biggest failures. And then and then they talk about how [01:05:20] brilliant it was for their lives. Yeah, we’re coming to the end of our time. Prav.

Speaker4: Um, [01:05:25] I guess that leaves us to tap into our final questions. [01:05:30] But just before we do that, Sarika, um, for those, um, out there listening [01:05:35] to this podcast, if they wanted to find out more information about your upcoming course that [01:05:40] you’re going to be running, how would they do that?

Speaker1: Okay. So they can access [01:05:45] my website, which is flourish as a female.com, and [01:05:50] they can also DM me on my Instagram platform which is Doctor Sarika Shah. [01:05:55] So absolutely. And they can go and learn about everything about the course [01:06:00] on their.

Speaker4: And we will. We will put the link to your website in the [01:06:05] show notes as well, so people can just click straight through if they if they want to find that. Um, just to, just [01:06:10] to make it a little bit easier. Fantastic. But on to our final question, Sarika. Let’s say, [01:06:15] um, you get to the the it’s your final day on the planet, right? And, um, [01:06:20] you’ve got your loved ones around you, and you had to leave them with three [01:06:25] pieces of wisdom. What would they be?

Speaker1: So I’d say [01:06:30] the first would be always prioritise your well-being. The [01:06:35] second would be always be your authentic self [01:06:40] and never sacrifice anything you [01:06:45] sense you will regret later on in life. The [01:06:50] third would be to adopt a champions discipline in managing your [01:06:55] time. And if I had one tiny, tiny little breath left, if I may, [01:07:00] is I would say that trust yourself. And [01:07:05] know that you are resourceful enough to make your dreams come true.

Speaker4: Lovely. [01:07:10] Lovely. And, um, how would you like to be remembered?

Speaker1: I [01:07:15] think as someone who inspired [01:07:20] so many women in dentistry and created huge [01:07:25] impact, not just in the UK, but on a global level. By creating [01:07:30] such a big change in their lives and being able to really get them [01:07:35] to flourish and thrive, not just in their professional life, but in everything that they do. [01:07:40] And I want to be remembered for someone that is therefore created a big [01:07:45] impact in the future of dentistry.

Speaker4: Beautiful. Absolutely beautiful. [01:07:50] Payman. Over to your party.

Speaker5: The [01:07:55] question is.

Speaker3: The question is a question about who you want to spend some time and talk to. So, fantasy dinner party. [01:08:00] Three guests, dead or alive. Who would you have?

Speaker1: So [01:08:05] my first one definitely would be Michelle Obama. The reason being is I [01:08:10] think that she has such a strong sense of self, and I think that even [01:08:15] before President Obama started his presidency, she [01:08:20] already had such a strong career and knew her goals is so much clarity. She’s just such [01:08:25] a strong human being, and I’d love to talk to her so much more about how [01:08:30] she continued to be herself and even more and still, [01:08:35] you know, and still be married to President Obama and still be able to support him. So I [01:08:40] think that her trying to understand where she got her sense of self from, for sure.

Speaker6: Hmm’hmm. [01:08:45]

Speaker3: It’s not the first time she’s. And who [01:08:50] would you have? Who else?

Speaker1: My second one would actually be Cleopatra. Um. [01:08:55] And I think she’s one of the. She’s an ancient queen. Right. [01:09:00] And again, in this, like, very patriarchal society [01:09:05] and how she used her intellect and [01:09:10] some of her female traits to be able to lead. And I’d love [01:09:15] to understand the challenges that she faced and how she overcame them, but how [01:09:20] she truly stayed true to herself right til the end, [01:09:25] right? She really fought for what she believed in. And I thought, that’s really inspiring. So definitely hard. [01:09:30]

Speaker5: And nice.

Speaker1: I guess my third one would be [01:09:35] Mahatma Gandhi, because once again, he has such an immense sense of [01:09:40] self and authenticity and he’s such an amazing communicator, [01:09:45] right? That was what was really interesting about him, that he was able to inspire and persuade [01:09:50] millions of people to create impact from an individual [01:09:55] level to a country to a global level. Right. And [01:10:00] he was able to combine this authenticity, his vision and his [01:10:05] purpose. And I guess, like Martin Luther King and Nelson Mandela, he was [01:10:10] such an effective communicator using verbal and nonverbal communication. But also, [01:10:15] I think, again, he was true to himself. Being Jain. He focussed his actions [01:10:20] using the founding principle of Jainism, which is non-violence. And he led so many [01:10:25] passive rebellions and protests. So I’d love to tap into his mind and have a fantasy [01:10:30] dinner with him. Definitely.

Speaker5: Brilliant.

Speaker4: Wonderful.

Speaker3: Thank you so much [01:10:35] for doing this. Looking looking forward to seeing to seeing how how how the course goes [01:10:40] and how the practice goes as well. Hopefully we have you back in five years and there’s a chain of platinums. [01:10:45] And thank you. Let’s see how it goes. Lovely to have you. Thank [01:10:50] you.

Speaker4: Yeah I’m really interested to see how the course evolves. Really? And, um, you [01:10:55] become this leading light for female dentists, not only here, but I really like [01:11:00] the way you articulated your vision globally. I think that’s I think that’s lovely. So [01:11:05] thank thanks for sharing today, Sarika, and thanks for your time.

Speaker1: Thank you so much. Thank you both. Have a [01:11:10] lovely day.

Speaker2: This is Dental Leaders, the [01:11:15] podcast where you get to go one on one with emerging leaders in dentistry. [01:11:20] Your hosts. Payman Langroudi [01:11:25] and Prav Solanki.

Speaker4: Thanks for listening, guys. If [01:11:30] you got this far, you must have listened to the whole thing. And just a huge thank you both from me and pay [01:11:35] for actually sticking through and listening to what we’ve had to say and what our guest has had to say, [01:11:40] because I’m assuming you got some value out of it.

Speaker3: If you did get some value out of it, think about [01:11:45] subscribing. And if you would share this with a friend who you think might get some [01:11:50] value out of it too. Thank you so so, so much for listening. Thanks.

Speaker4: And don’t forget our six star rating. [01:11:55]